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You Might Not Actually Like Jesus
Episode No. 82

Conversation Three. “I think it is worth digging into this, if you don’t spend regular time with Jesus, you might not actually like Him. We talk about our faith story with Jesus and the church in the third conversation in the Conversations series. We are trying to model how to build a deep meaningful relationship with those you do life with.

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Resource – True Face: Beyond the Mask.
Verse – John 15:13.
Verse – John 15:15.
Resource – Junto Emotion Wheel.


Josh – I hello hello hello we’re just 2 normal dudes trying to live this jesus life. My name’s Josh.

Andrew – Hey I’m Andrew and we are this jesus life podcast Josh we’re back my friend we’re podcasting how you doing.

Josh – Andrew we’re podcasts and again I’m doing well can’t complain. Whether’s decent, a pretty uneventful weekend so that’s always nice and get you know, do things you don’t have to do. It’s true.

Andrew – It’s almost easter man you got ah have yeah, have you eaten any peeps or anything I mean it’s it’s palm Sunday when we’re recording so have you started in on any easter chocolate peeps.

Josh – Is that a tradition for you that eat peeps on Palm sunday.

Andrew – No I was just curious. You know like I know you live close to King Super’s and I’m like I don’t know have you bought any peeps in do in yet because I would if I was that close.

Josh – Um, no I think Easter I think Easter Wise Easter has the worst candy that like sweetes that are out there for a holiday like they like to do like those those Mot What do they call those things Moth Motballs or.

Andrew – You’re probably right? Yeah dude Halloween is way better. Yeah, the mothball. Yeah non mothballs mot balls. Maybe some like that. Yes, yes.

Josh – Um, not to balls. Yeah yeah, that look like the big gum like pieces of gum but they’re not in this nasty like yeah.

Andrew – Yeah, and they’re just like weird crunchy chocolate styrofoam.

Josh – I Don’t know who likes those things and this is the only time a year that they’re ever sold is during Easter This is like their time to shine like no, we need come with like gummy bears are like gummy chick chicks something something needs to come back. Oh jelly beans. That’s fair.

Andrew – Um, yeah, ah okay, jelly beans I think Jelly Beams do jelly beans are solid. They’re the one.

Josh – Yeah.

Andrew – They’re okay and peeps I like peeps but not everybody likes marshmallows but jelly beans. It’s like how can you especially the Starburst Jelly beans this Jesus Life dot Com Slash Starburst for ah, just kidding. Um, but ah yeah, dude.

Josh – Now.

Josh – Yeah, our kick back from the servers corporation.

Andrew – Yeah, we kind of bigs. We have a huge starburst poor partnership. That’s why we’re talking to Easter candy um, just kidding that’d be hilarious if it was true though. But ah yeah man, the starburst jelly beans are like the every flavor is delicious. That’s what’s up. Totally.

Josh – That’s fair Starbucks are pretty tasty jelly beans in general are pretty good, but that’s really that’s really it have you have you thrown a peep inside the microwave for your daughters yet.

Andrew – Yeah, that’s it Dude you you know? well no, not for my dot. Okay I Still don’t own a microwave bro. Um, actually that’s a lie I I own a Mike I know like.

Josh – I forgot you have 1 in your trailer.

Andrew – No okay, here’s the thing I have one actively listed on Facebook marketplace to sell there was one that came in my camper and they’re like yeah we just bought this. It’s brand new. We haven’t even used it. But here you go I’m like great um dude.

Josh – And you’re like morally against them so you have to get rid of it immediately. Yeah.

Andrew – Well in the camper I just have like such limited space and we we aren’t used to using microwaves at all so like between the indoor like range and outdoor grill that hangs on the side and like the campfire I’m like we don’t need that We don’t do that So I’m selling it.

Josh – Um, how do you? How do you heat up? How do you heat up um like leftovers like you just throw them on a pan again.

Andrew – Um, selling that.

Andrew – Throw them in a pan throw them on in the oven like you know all that stuff. Yeah man. Yeah, we do have a toaster oven. It’s a little no no toast.

Josh – Wow. Do you have like ah what do they call it like a toaster oven or does that feel. Okay I didn’t know if that felt too Microwavy for you and you’re like now we’re against it. We just morally I think.

Andrew – Yeah, we have a van. Yeah, if you just yeah, that’s what it is dude. It’s a theological stance. No, we’re just like.

Josh – Jesus hates microwaves.

Josh – Yeah, so I thought.

Andrew – A little bit hippy. Dippy. That’s why we don’t have at first it started by like our apartment was tiny and we’re like we don’t have space for microwave and then you know me being overly all pretty conspiratorial and and Jana being pretty healthy. We’re just like. That doesn’t seem like a good thing for food and then we just have stayed weird and haven’t ever got a microwave. So yeah, man going on ah 10 years this June being married to Jana and we have never had a microwave that whole time. Yeah.

Josh – So wait when you moved into your house did it did it have a microwave you had to get rid of really.

Andrew – No no, they didn’t um yeah like I think they must have had like a really old 1 they like threw hey or something but it wasn’t like they didn’t have a microwave like we have an oven in the wall where most people would probably have microwave you know so.

Josh – Ok.

Josh – So what goes above your stove if it’s not a microwave.

Andrew – Just event. Ah, that’s it and then spices and stuff spice cabinet and all that above that. Um, yeah man, we’re ah but right right.

Josh – Craziness not that I use my microwave that often but like something feels wrong to like throw my carni asada be on back in a pan after it’s been cooked for my tacos and not throwing in the microwave for a minute.

Andrew – Here’s the thing bro it. Ah it deepens the flavor it makes it better. It’s like it’s you should try it sometime and just be like I know this is going to take 5 minutes more and make a dirty pan but I’m going to try it. Yeah.

Josh – Now because if if I’m pulling something out to eat and I’m throwing it in the microwave I Want to eat pretty damn fast. That’s why I’m putting it in the microwave I don’t want to heat up the oven. Yeah.

Andrew – Ah, yeah, right, Convenience over quality is that I know you’re a big you know, big yeah who needs quality man like it’s only the food you live on you know I’m just get I’m just being done.

Josh – Yeah, let’s think like what else do I throw in the microwave and I don’t I don’t I don’t throw peeps in the microwave. No I don’t I don’t want to miss time it and have to be the one to clean it up.

Andrew – Peeps which is what started this and that is the best way to eat a peep by the way you don’t ah that is the best way to do it. Yeah, it can get pretty hairy huh.

Josh – If it was someone else’s microwave I Guess yeah I have no problem with that. But my microwave.

Andrew – Dude if you put a peep in the microwave you better be standing right? there looking at it every single second because they they grow rapidly and you don’t want that sucker to hit the top or sides of your microwave That’s for sure so fast.

Josh – Yeah, and ah because it’s going to cool down so fast that like I’d be a nightmare to clean up. Actually I Just what did I put in microwave recently? um I I put something in the microwave recently took to warm it up.

Andrew – Yeah, yeah.

Josh – And my microwave is gross like disgustingly gross. Ah like I even have like 1 of those shields that you put over all your food like old people I don’t know where I got it but I have one and it’s still gross and I was like what the heck happened in this thing.

Andrew – Yeah, yeah, ah.

Andrew – Yeah, yeah, and it’s still nasty Qvc right? Great Yeah man.

Josh – Um, but yeah I don’t know at some point I’ll have to clean it but microves just seem like a pain in the butt to clean seems like too much work just not worth it and you close the door. You don’t look at it. It needs a self-cleaning feature like my oven. That’s what I need any microwave that cleans itself.

Andrew – Yeah, yeah, yeah, dude for a yeah yeah so I was an ah r a in college and like responsible for a hall. Of dudes living in a dorm because I went to Indiana Wesleyan and like men and women live in separate dorms. You know so um, one like my sophomore year was when I was first in r a and like. Dude the things people like everybody used the microwave in the break room that was like part of our hall but it got so nasty so quickly and like it fell to me ah to like keep it functional. So like I kept bringing it up I kept like.

Josh – Oh I bet.

Josh – Oh really, that sucks.

Andrew – Yeah, but I was like I’m not cleaning this thing so I kept being like like I didn’t even use the microwave then except for very rarely like ramen or something and I wasn’t making messes. So Anyway I like we had this meeting and I’m like guys if. If you don’t like clean up the microwave whoever uses that thing like clean it when you use it and if you don’t like we’re just getting rid of the microwave and they thought I was like joking.

Josh – A.

Andrew – And so anyway for like three days I evicted the microwave and locked it in this closet that I had a key to I’m just like yeah no microwave and.

Josh – So so you’re anti your antiicwave things been around for a long time. You’re saying That’s what I’m hearing like most of your adult life. You’re an anti. Yeah, you’re an anti microwave First It’s good to know.

Andrew – It’s been around. Yeah man, it’s been years and we’re talking origins and conversations background. Yeah, it’s been back then it was just because I’m like I’m not cleaning up your nasty crap. Like old chili coated and cheese coated in like whatever else popped up here like dude I’m not no. So yeah, man microwave stuff goes deep. Yeah, right? yeah.

Josh – Yeah I Can only imagine what I’m like with. Trying to think like where’s a common I Assume we probably have a microwave in the office at somewhere I don’t know where it is and probably one of the kitchenettes. There’s a microwave I’ve just never looked I Wonder what that looks like I assume we pay someone to clean it down. So Let’s worry about it.

Andrew – Don’t don’t look in it if you yeah if you do find it in there. Don’t look in the ins. Don’t look at the roof because that’s where all the nasty stuff happens. You know the the inside top is a who make you throw up. Dude.

Josh – That reminds me so ah in biology and I think I took biology my sophomore year of high school and we were trying to grow germs is like the thing so like she had us go around with petri dish and like grab parts of the school that we thought would have a lot of germs on it.

Andrew – Um, wow.

Andrew – 2

Josh – Like you go with like qtapping you like wipe it on there and they wipe it out the petri dish and then throw it in the thing and watch things grow. Um, the nastiest place that we it because like you’re in a high school first place you’re going is either the bathrooms. The locker rooms right? Those gonna be the nastiest places. Ah.

Andrew – Gross. Yeah, yes, right? right.

Josh – Urinals relatively clean just at Foi probably because no one ever touches them. They don’t even in high school shoot. You’re even try. You’re not even you’re not even touching the the handle to flush it. You don’t just leave it there. Ah but but door handles door handles everywhere were.

Andrew – Wow Sanitary cakes you know, yeah P and it and leave Oh oh.

Josh – Disgusting and if you were a germ for germaphobe. You probably would never open a door yet. It was disgusting every door not just bath like every door was gross and then the somebody. Yeah yeah, that whole you know.

Andrew – Grows. Oh nasty, nasty gross man that makes me want to clean our house Doorknobs. Oh.

Josh – Walking around with lyceol thing your parents used to do that like annoyed you because it smelled grosuses at least it annoyed me because it smelled gross. Um, yeah, see why they did it I get it I get it now the worst place the 1 group ah swab the drain in the.

Andrew – Yeah, right see why they did it? Yeah yeah, yeah.

Josh – I Don’t know if it’s the boys of the girl’s locker room but is in a locker room drain. So that there’s like that’s probably pretty nasty.

Andrew – Yeah, oh I bet yeah, that sounds real gross dude. Um, so I know we should dive in in just a second but I do have a short story. Ah for you that I want to tell you because it’s. What I’m going to be doing with my afternoon after we ah after we talk. Um, so so you’ve known Janna for a long time and I think this will not surprise you at all, you know she loves growing plants and gardening and that dude when she is pumped about something. She just gets passionate quickly. So all right, there’s these so we’ve been like plant. We have a ton of plants in the basement with like a tiny like like grow setup we have like grow lights and like a little. Like heater pads and all this stuff that like have grown tons of these little plants from seeds like tomatoes peppers all kinds of stuff. So Jana ah planted some seeds directly in the garden in the last few weeks but it’s still kind of cold. Um, it’s called direct sowing where you sow the seeds without sprouting them right into the ground so she did that a few weeks ago. Um, and we built these like hoop houses but but are we put them up hoop houses but called low tunnels that are like. You know like twenty feet long and like a foot and a half wide and like these little you put in these little hoops in the ground and like put like cloth over it basically real simple like I don’t know 15 minutes to make like no problem like you just basically get the kit put it out. You’re good to go so yesterday morning Jenna goes. Um, she’s like hey do you think we’ll be able to get up that hoop house today and I was like oh yeah, like thinking of just another one of those like yeah, no problem like I could do that you know while the girls are napping or whatever like no problem. Um, and didn’t think too much about it until right before lunchtime Jana’s like hey could I have one of your tape measures I’m like sure so she goes out there comes back in and declares. Um, yeah, twenty feet by ten feet is going to fit all of our tomatoes that’s going to be perfect. When are you going to lows like what what are you? What are you talking about? She’s like the hoopouts just needs to be twenty feet long by ten feet wide and you know you can just like do a bigger version of the one I say you? ah.

Andrew – So dude I’m building a greenhouse um straight up like you can call it a hoop house but it is ah it’s a greenhouse man. It’s intense. So that’s what I’ll be working on.

Josh – Wow.

Josh – Um, is this didn’t um, didn’t the state you live in. Um, recently approve medical Marijuana or recreational Marijuana is your.

Andrew – I actually I think they did for tomatoes. No it really is tomatoes and other veggies. But ah, it’s not Colorado tomatoes aka pot. It’s not that.

Josh – Is your greenhouse actually for a side business. Yeah tomatoes.

Andrew – Ah, although I’m sure it would grow well there um things grow really easily here. So I can’t imagine what hot but ah, but no so I don’t know so I got a ton of pvc pipe I got some 2 by 4 s ah. Plastic all this stuff man I’ll I’ll send you pictures later but um I think it’s gonna work out but it blew my mind when I’m like wait 20 by ten feet what are we talking about so anyway, dude I wanted to tell you that.

Josh – I’m telling you she has she has big dreams for the tomato business and this is what it’s gonna take her like she needs she needs a lot of tomatoes slash weed to sell to all her mom friends at mobs and.

Andrew – Yeah, guess it’s what it’s going to take. Um, dude it was funny I sent a picture of my like growth stuff to my mom or I was in the and I it she’s like there’s not any weed down there. It’s there or she joked with me about that. And I was like no but if we keep investing this much in the garden. It might have to start growing some just to offset the garden fund. Ah dude, no joke in our bank accounts I have one very small savings account but 1 labeled garden fund and I just started like.

Josh – But yeah, you need to figure out some way to make some money.

Josh – You have a savings account just for your garden fund.

Andrew – Putting spare dollars in there because I’m like yeah yeah and whenever we’re done gardening I’ll switch it to like whatever we’re trying to like we’re gonna get a new couch at some point so it’ll probably become the couch fund after Garden season but I like I just like to have one little account that I’m like this is for a thing or.

Josh – That’s finally.

Andrew – In this case, it’s for a greenhouse for tons of seeds for new lights for I don’t know pot I guess like all kinds of things. Oh.

Josh – Interesting. So do you, let’s let’s talk about the the Hanna’s finances for a second because this intrigued me. Um, so do you have multiple accounts is that how you manage your money like you’re saving stuff like you don’t manage cash flow and that kind of stuff.

Andrew – Did sure.

Andrew – No, no so like so Jana’s business is all one account. That’s actually not even it’s not in the same account at all. She can transfer dollars to it to our main checking and savings one and then I have like.

Josh – And like externally.

Josh – Okay.

Andrew – Checking and then I have an emergency fund that’s savings and then general savings and then one that’s like floating next mid-size purchase account so Garden fund because you know spent quite a bit on like.

Josh – Interesting.

Andrew – Lots of seeds and I’m going to need to get some new fencing and apparently in building a greenhouse in the midst of this like that type of stuff. But ah but I knew enough to know I should start saving for all that um and then Jana’s business account. We just treat as like totally separate and like she. Gives out of it and pays business bills and and then just saves for like it’s like family experience fund is what we kind of consider that to be so business uses and then things like it was the camper fund for like a year and a half

Josh – Family experience on.

Andrew – And now we have a camper so it’s like she’s gonna start saving towards the next stuff. So yeah, man, that’s hand a family finance is one a 1 if you’re interested. Yeah yeah.

Josh – Interesting. Yeah I only have a high yield savings account ah through what’s Marcus sack or Golden Golden Sacs like savings program Marcus I think what’s called I said Marcus Sacks see I got it right away.

Andrew – Mark Sac is it. Mark Sacck Mark’s sack can you hold onto this for me. Dude it’s silver and gold. Ah.

Josh – It’s called mar is by goal. Well, that’s where I put my money is inside of Mark sack as like hey Mark can you put this in your sack and hold onto it for me. Ah and by high yield like at 1 point it was it did pretty well and then you know all the interest rates all started dying. So it’s not really high yield anywhere’s just regular seeings count.

Andrew – Right? write write.

Josh – But yeah, all the other stuff I Just let sit in my just my checking account and then I manage it externally of what the cash flow is through there.

Andrew – See I could do that but I like to I like to be able to separate the categories. So I’m like okay, there’s like emergency dollars here’s general savings and then here’s like savings for a short-term purpose you know and then like basically just retirement through work stuff. You know.

Josh – Oh yeah, good old retirement accounts. They might be. We don’t know chickens. Ah yeah.

Andrew – That’s in its own thing. So yeah man, that’s what’s up, but the people aren’t here to hear about finances here that they’re here to hear about gardening and and where the nasty places are in their houses and chickens and and Jesus too like and like you know following god and all that.

Josh – Yeah, a little little bit of the of the Jesus man this is a little bit just so we can stay true to our our our podcast you know name but we do yeah Andrew I know that we’ve both looked.

Andrew – Little bit a little bit of that. Yeah.

Andrew – Dude, we got to stay true to it. We got us. It’s a good name. It’s a good name. Yeah.

Josh – Looked into this app I know you were using it for a little while um but we have an agreement with the dwell being one of their affiliates. Um, and dwell is is a beautiful app that um is a great way to get into foster relationship with Jesus through.

Andrew – Um, yeah, boom.

Andrew – It’s a good. It’s a good service.

Josh – Um, audio versions of the bible. So if you haven’t had a chance to check out dwell yet. Um, it’s definitely worth a checkout then we do get a little bit of kickback when you sign up for a subscription. Um, but if you go to this Jesus Lifepodcast Dot Com Forward Slash Dwell um you can get started with those guys and start. Foster relationship Jesus especially if you don’t have ah a habit now of doing it. Great great app to download. It’s going to be entertaining and how it’s read. It’s going to give you a little bit of inspiration to kick off those conversations with Jesus going to give you those daily reminders.

Andrew – Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Josh – Um, ah when you have forgotten to spend some time with Jesus. Um, so if you don’t have that daily habit already. This is a great way to get into that debut habit it’s dwell lives right? there on your phone super quick and easy. You can pick plans that that fit um, kind of where you’re at in life. Um, but that’s this Jesus Lifepodcast Dot Com Forward Slash

Andrew – Yeah.

Andrew – Yum.

Andrew – And let me just say dude wait wait on the dwell on the dwell thing. Let’s get like we always try to get practical in this show of like Okay so what does it mean and like we’ve talked so much about like reading the bible or listening to the bible which I’m so auditory that.

Josh – Well, but Andrew we’re also in the middle go ahead.

Andrew – Listening is helpful for me and so like I read the bible to my my daughter often but like physical bible but I like to listen like while I’m showering or most mornings like while the coffee’s brewing I like to put audio. Versions the bible on and dude like dwell is cool because it’s like way different takes on that. Um that that’s really Engaging. So if you want to form a habit of listening to the bible or having your kids have the opportunity to hear the bible more. Or just like filling your space of waiting on the coffee to brew time with something that’s going to stick with you in the day. Try it out like go and you can do a free trial and if you want to keep going with it. Make sure to use our code but ah or sign up through this Jesus Life dot Com Slash dwell. But anyway I just wanted to chime in with that because it’s like I don’t know man. It’s always better to start the day by listening to scripture and I feel like I every time I do that like half the times I’m just like I don’t know what I got out of that necessarily but cool. And then later in the day something will hit me and be like oh yeah, that was like Psalm 78 or whatever that I was listening to That’s pretty Awesome. So yeah, man, all about it.

Josh – Noise well we’re in the middle of a series. We’re calling conversations. These conversations are designed to really foster. Ah, a place to be fully known and to fully know someone else. Um, so. This is designed to do one on 1 face-to-face. We wanted to model this because we think it’s a helpful ah conversation to hear this comes from ah an organization called Trueface we’ll link in the show notes at this how to get signed up with them. Um, to get access to the videos and to some of these questions we don’t answer all the questions but we do answer a good portion of these questions. Um, there’s a couple of rules that we live by inside of these conversations. Um, we want to make sure this is a safe place. This is a rule that Andrew and I break because well this is a podcast and it’s a public form but you do want to create a safe space where what’s said. Ah, between the 2 of you is is stays between the 2 of you and you know doesn’t doesn’t get out kind of thing so people can feel safe to share wherever they’re at whatever they’re thinking with with somebody else. We try to do our best to to model that but at the same time you know our lives are intertwined with other people’s lives.

Andrew – Um, yeah.

Josh – And we don’t want to share things that maybe those that are intertwined in our lives would like to be shared in a public form. So um, we try to monitor as best we possibly can um to that. But it still try to be real other 2 rules is no preaching um and no fixing so we inside these environments. We want to just be known.

Andrew – Yeah.

Andrew – Ah, yeah.

Andrew – Yeah.

Josh – Um, so we’re trying to create a space where where we can be known. You know you know plenty of people from the fixing perspective that you share something and um, you’re just trying to share it to get it off your chest and now you’re their pet project and they want to tell you all the ways that you should fix. Whatever’s going on. Um, so be careful to offer. Advice or suggestions unless being asked for and then no preaching you know Jesus more than capable of of leading that sanctification process and and developing you into who he’s called you to be um, you don’t we don’t need to use this environment to to preach at people.

Andrew – Right? right.

Josh – Um, to be like well you’re wrong and you’re morally wrong and you’re goingnna go to hell because Jesus said so um, we’re not gonna weaponize truth but at the same time if we’re at if truth is being asked for share truth and if you have enough relational collateral but this this specific thing is not designed.

Andrew – Um.

Andrew – Yeah, right? yeah.

Josh – To be a preaching place but we’re going to preach on this because well we’re a podcast and that’s probably why you’re listening. But yeah, that’s kind of the ground rules. This is conversation number 3 Andrew you want to give us like an overview of what this conversation’s going to cover.

Andrew – Yeah man so some of the some of the questions um here my wife would be stoked if she was looking because part of it involves a feelings wheel which is a good tool that we’ll talk a little bit about but um, kind of like How do we think that god views us you know, last time we we hit on part of question or part of conversation too was around like over your religious experience and growing up like what are the descriptors of how you viewed god and there were things like judge vending machine theoretical safety net. All of that and and Josh and I had a good talk about that and like how we thought god viewed us or how we viewed god this week is a lot more like how do we think god views us like what does he see when he looks at us. How does he feel about us. Um, how do we feel about him. You know about god and then ah can we protect like connect those feelings to like a set of beliefs that we have so yeah man it should be pretty cool. Um, that’s for sure and one one really like good. Supporting scripture of this type of conversation is at a psalm one thirty nine it’s verses 13 and 14 it says this for you formed my inward parts you knitted me together in my wonder mother’s womb I praise you for I’m fearfully and wonderfully made wonderful. Are your works. My soul. Knows it very well. So that’s one of the good like scriptures to to back this and yeah man, why don’t you I’ve I’ve had the pleasure of going first each time so would you be willing to kind of kick us off on on one of those questions in any order that. Ah, you want to go in.

Josh – Ah, yeah I should be better at paying attention inside the podcast and giving him attention but a previous client just emailed me today Iss A working day. So um I was responding to them because and then you go this is a complete sidetrack. But.

Andrew – Sweet.

Andrew – Ah.

Josh – Own a design business on the side build branding and websites if you’re interested, um a millionus in revenue is typically the business I work with just and fy or you’re going to look at my prices and be like whoa. You’re ridiculous I know um.

Andrew – Yeah.

Josh – But I built a website for a crossfit gym year. Maybe even two years ago and they just reached out with a bunch of questions and I just went to their website which I’ve been to since you know was released and it’s completely mangled I don’t even this is why.

Andrew – And oh well.

Josh – This is why if you’re building a website business owners even personal websites and you don’t exactly know what you’re doing when it comes to managing them and working on you know funnels and all those fun things and getting content on there. You should just pay someone to manage it for you or your website ends up in complete.

Andrew – Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Josh – Disray when you try to do it yourself and try to save a buck. It’s worth. It’s worth the investment. You’re not going to pay a crap ton of money That’s a few thousand dollars a year kind of thing. But yeah, sorry, but yeah, completely completely mangled and like what have you been up to.

Andrew – Yeah.

Andrew – Nice Josh can help you out if you need help though. That’s all we’re trying to say okay.

Josh – Whole time here. It’s not that’s really, it’s really a plug just for me to make more money. That’s really all I’m asking for but no joke. Well we’ll treat you well. But yeah conversation number 3 What do you think about god what do you think.

Andrew – Um, yeah.

Josh – God said about you and looking through a 1 ne-way glass oh man. Ah I think it’s I think it’s probably different at man I don’t even maybe it’s not different at different times of my life. Um I just understand it differently like.

Andrew – Who Yeah. Ah.

Josh – You know I think we I shared this last week but I grew up in a pretty low key legalistic environment in the church you grew up with wasn’t broadcast but like you can feel you can feel the waves under the service are under the under the scenes. Um, so like god for. For a good portion of my life was like I think someone I’ve heard I’ve heard someone use the terminal just waiting for the other shoe to drop like you’ve screwed up 1 too many times that god’s like yeah I’m done like I’ve given you too many chances I’m out. Um and just walked away from the whole thing. So and that’s just know who god is.

Andrew – Who. Um, great.

Andrew – Rate.

Josh – Um, so like a good portion of my life is probably that of like he’s this this distant judge. That’s just waiting to um, probably break the glass and like choke me like Homer Simpson and Bart like that kind of moment like when are you going to ever learn.

Andrew – Um, right right.

Josh – Um, you keep doing the same stupid things over and over again. Um, but you know now I don’t think I think this is who god is and this is how he views me but I wouldn’t say this is how I’ve always viewed this to be true, but I know it to be true. You know god has a ah heavy amount of graces. Um to be shown. Um, sin is still destructive and sin’s going to destroy aspects of relationship and your life as we participate in them. But um, like even in the midst of those things god is god is compassion. Um, you know judgment sure is coming. You know god is the ultimate judge. And is a perfect judge at that. But I think there’s a lot of compassion and Grace given um to those that that love and follow him that we often don’t see you know we can’t forgive ourselves or we can’t be forgiven by others so we assume god acts the same way and you know as he says.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – When when forgiveness is asked for forgiveness is given and we you we throw us as far as the east is from the west he watches you wide as snow you know when he looks at you God The father you know he sees the sacrifice of God the son so you’re you know you’re covered probably a glues gruesome picture you’re covered in his blood. But.

Andrew – Yeah.

Josh – In the midst of that your widest snow make sense of that imagery. Um, so yeah I think I think during different parts of my life. Um God was always out there just waiting me to script too much and the vengeance is going to come and I think a lot of people live that way.

Andrew – Who.

Josh – Um I think it’s how I think it’s how people get your behavior. Um, they manipulate the view of God in that way. Um I think this is a great message for parents. Be careful how you portray God you know he’s not the daddy. That’s you know, just wait till your father gets home. Um, you know he’s not that type of.

Andrew – Who.

Josh – Of Disciplinarian now he does disciplinaryary guide but not in not in how you pit would picture it. Um, you know punishment isn’t necessarily like the the quote unquote punishment you experience in your life I don’t think is.

Andrew – Great.

Josh – Necessarily at God’s directing. But I do think it’s at your sins results that God chose not to Intervene on you know he’s gonna give you what you? what? you desire to teach you what he needs to teach you to get you to where you want he wants you to go. So I think his discipline lives in those those categories that.

Andrew – Who.

Josh – You know as a big mean disciplinarian so what would god think what did you think god said about you when you’re looking through the 1 ne-way glass when looking through 1 way glass. Um.

Andrew – I think this is like what if if god were on the other side of 1 way glass looking at you what kind of stuff. Do you think he’d be saying to you these days are saying about what he sees of you. What.

Josh – Yeah. Yeah, he’s mine I think he I would say he’s mine I think is what God is like now he’s might have like I’m the master but like like ah like ah, a good father would look at his son like no matter the circumstances of the son’s life no Matter. What he may have done or the ways he may have disappointed. You. There’s still like this this pride in that of looking I’m saying like yeah that he’s Mine. He’s he’s my son. Um I think there’s other pieces of it that he’s just proud of things that that I’m chasing um in this season of life.

Andrew – Hit. He.

Josh – Um, reorienting a lot of life to focus in on what he told us to focus in on and his mission of fishing for people um doing the work that I need to do personally so he can get me to where he wants me to go so being? um.

Andrew – Um, yeah.

Josh – Aware and engaged in the sanctification process and talking with Jesus through those things I think at times even in this season like god probably misses me not that like he yeah sure he’s ever present. But like there’s definitely.

Andrew – Yeah.

Josh – Weeks where yeah you look back at it and like man how often did I really spend time with god um, and you have to you know, refocus yourself so they think there’s that piece of like man. He’s probably like Josh where were you this last week I talked to you twice? Um, what else.

Andrew – Who.

Josh – Um, there’s probably even things where he’s like Josh man I’ve been I’ve been trying to say this over and over again and you’re not hearing me and I’m trying all these different things and you’re just you’re missing it and then you’re wondering why you know something is the way that it is and.

Andrew – Um, yeah.

Andrew – Of the.

Josh – Been trying to to get you to where I need you to go in this specific area. Whatever maybe we all have blind spots and he’s like man if you just the depth of life. You would feel the depth of relation you would experience if you just chose to engage this thing. Whatever the thing is I’m just speaking theoretically I don’t.

Andrew – Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, man that’s ah, it’s good. That’s it’s so interesting to hear you.

Josh – Exactly no. But I assume there’s something Um, so that’s probably part of it too. But what about you? What do you think? God’s saying about you and looking through the one my glass.

Andrew – Kind of talk through that you know of what what you think god would really say about you. Um, the first thing that my mind went to um, like I feel like he’d be looking through the glass and and it’s interesting because I ah I believe god is very present. And aware of of what’s going on in our lives like our actions as well as our thoughts like down into levels. We don’t even understand of why we think and do the things we do think god fully comprehends those? um and I think he is present like always paying attention. Um. But not in that way of like I’m about to judge you like the gavel is about to fall you know, um, just present and like I am with you like I want to be with you in all things. Um, and yeah man, um, all that said I think that I think god might be saying. Often about me like you don’t have to do this alone. You know and and I don’t think that’s like intended to be on the other side of glass I can’t hear or see through I think that’s probably just like a theme in my life is that i. Try to push hard and whether it be building a greenhouse on a win or making a big choice or doing whatever like I’m pretty quick to want to just do things myself, you know or like in the expedient way or like I can get this done or I know the right decision or whatever. Um, pretty pretty quick to get in that line of thinking obviously not saying I’m gonna handle this myself I got it but just having this like no just like I’ll run with it I don’t you know I’m good I can make that decision I can go with it and. And I think god often would be saying about me like hey like you don’t have to do this alone Andrew like slow slow down like I want to I want help you know like I want to be a part of this I want to guide you in this decision I want to guide you in the stuff and like the other night I got all mad at at my daughter in.

Josh – Yeah.

Andrew – while while I was getting her down for bed I was just really frustrated and like ah patience was thin after a full day of like small ah bickering about things like 3 years it’s okay to be 3 but it’s hard sometimes on parents and and it was hard on me a couple days ago and I got.

Josh – Yeah.

Andrew – Like to the end of bedtime and and like then I just realized like man I was way too hard on her like way too hard on her for for dumb stuff and I was just being like frustrated and impatient and all of that and I was praying and I’m like God like man help. Help give me presence of mind in moments like that to just step back and be like no like I’m gonna be a good dad and she doesn’t need me to tell her to go to sleep and do these things she needs me to just be kind and good like God is to me and yeah man like I just I too often. Forget. God is present and wants to help and would actually not just help like you and I can help each other you know, but God like can guide and make everything better by being a part of what we’re doing. You know, um and that’s what I mean when I say I want to help like you don’t have to do this alone. That’s what.

Josh – Yeah, um.

Andrew – That’s what comes to mind first for me man that’s for sure. Yeah.

Josh – Yeah, like I I Really like the analogies that we use with parents and children in applying those characteristics to God and and us like there. There probably isn’t a more caring protective type of relationship.

Andrew – Yeah.

Andrew – Um, yeah.

Josh – Than that for healthy parents. But I think we we sometimes take that illustration too far where we get annoyed with our children and I say that collectively because I don’t have children but and like we assume. Well, That’s the that’s the illustration’s been used So God probably gets annoyed in that way with us and I think we have to be careful of putting certain characteristics especially characteristics of who God is that we don’t find in scripture and don’t find in the new covenant to be to apply to.

Andrew – Yeah.

Josh – How god is viewing us I think’s important piece of of of really embracing because like the reality is even say even if god was annoyed in some way I don’t think under the new covenant god of what works that way like you know forgiveness is forgiveness. Um, but. Um, like when you when you know that someone is is annoyed by you. Um, the chances of you well, unless you’re a people pleaser. Um the chances of you engaging that relationship deeply slim to none like you’re but that’s not what god wants like god wants relationship god wants to have conversation god wants to know you and you know him in intimate and vulnerable ways where trust is abundant so he can get you where he wants you to go? Um, but in the midst of that like if if we find ourselves. You know, being annoyed like man. It’s just it’s destructive to relationships. So I think it’s we got to be careful, really careful about applying those characteristics to god um, and and how you interact with him. Um, and you know that’s why this conversation specifically is is so important is. You know how do you really how is god you know how you really view how do you really see god viewing you there. We go. That’s a tongue coaster words. Um, and you know dig into those things in a like because like you asked me shoot 2 three years ago four years ago like I’d have a.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – Definitely different view of of God and how he views me than I do today like God’s gone done done a lot of work in my heart and and a lot of work and just who I am and how I interact with him. Um, and you know I thought was all behavior based even though I funny is I preached the opposite of that but like.

Andrew – So yeah.

Andrew – Um, yeah in.

Josh – What else do you measure on like that’s really hard so you can measure on behavior. So what’s my behavior like well I’m just not spending enough time with him or I’m not you know I’m not evangelizing like he’s asked me to or I’m not um, you know, living in Harmony with the people that I’m supposed to live like there’s all these different things that we judge Behavior off of it and it’s not like.

Andrew – Yeah.

Josh – Behavior is sure is a part of of the story but it’s not the entirety of the story. Um, like I can manipulate my behavior to look better than my character right? like to look better than the real me. Um, that’s where you get in scary grounds right? We think but then.

Andrew – Um, right right? yeah.

Josh – That’s what we teach you as christians so you end up in these weird places where’re like nah. Everything’s great look at me look how awesome I am like god god should actually give me what I want because I’m such a good Christian um, you’re like whoa like there’s what an example of that in the old covenant. Um was it. Um. Turned murrow on my head of you know, um, this is Joseph Demit not Joseph. Ah maybe it was Joseph demanding. Ah you know god give him the blessing because you know all the things that he’s done for him. Um I’m sorry I maybe maybe I have a different view of god than you do, but. I don’t think we’re in any position to demand anything from god I’m sorry ah like the level the level of the lack of humid levels in that statement and mind boggling I couldn’t couldn’t couldn’t help you there. But yeah, what were you gonna say Andrew.

Andrew – Right? right. Hey can I jump in I was just gonna say it like on the you’re totally right on the parenting analogy stuff and like to clarify what I was saying is like I I’m way too quick to to do it on my own you know, um.

Josh – Yeah I wasn’t I wasn’t that was just a jumping out point I wasn’t saying that’s true of you. Yeah.

Andrew – When I say do it I mean? Yeah, yeah, totally totally. But what I’m saying is like the um like god is is good as a parent as a father as a maker like god is always good and wouldn’t get frustrated with me for. You know, being 32 you know it’s okay to be 3 it’s okay to be 32 god wouldn’t get upset with me for being you know for behaving the way that makes sense for me to behave you know, um, with that said like I I should have been.

Josh – Um, yeah.

Andrew – Like I want to be present enough in my relationship with god where I can hear him poking and guiding and pushing me through the holy spirit even in moments when I’m starting to get annoyed about things that really don’t matter long term like you know did she stay up an extra 20 minutes past when she should be asleep.

Josh – Yeah.

Andrew – Doesn’t really matter that much in the long run you know, but what what could matter could leave a mark is like oh do I Go angry Dad bode The second that she starts breaking the expectations I have because like that’s going to leave an impact on her. You know like it’s not going to help her.

Josh – This bill. Yeah, yeah.

Andrew – Have a good picture of who God is so that’s why that stuff That’s what I mean is like I think God looks through the mirror often in my life and is like hey and it like I Probably just don’t hear it but like you don’t have to do it alone I can help you in this like I can show you I can teach I can guide you and I’m just like whatever I’m.

Josh – No.

Andrew – Mad I’m not going to listen I’m doing it my own way and it just doesn’t work out better that way. So anyway man yeah I just wanted to clarify what I was thinking and I knew you weren’t saying Andrew you’re making terrible analogy I just thought it was worth flushing it out a little bit more. Yeah.

Josh – Yeah, yeah.

Josh – no yeah no I figured where you’re going. Um I think too like with this question, there’s a piece of it too. That’s like it’s a 1 ne-way mirror so you’re seeing yourself as well and there’s probably work that can be done of like how do you view yourself.

Andrew – Yeah man.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – And compared to some to how God views themselves and do they line up I think the point of the question is they they probably don’t for most of us you know how you view yourself as for for the good of the bad right? like maybe yourself in certain areas like I am I am the best the God created perfection.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – When he created me in whatever area happens to be where God’s like now now. Yeah sure you’re unique, but you’re not special. Um like so there’s probably a piece of that. But then there’s the other side of like.

Andrew – Right.

Andrew – It’s right.

Josh – Um, ugly I’m worthless nobody loves me like there’s that piece of it too that you may be seeing about yourself and god’s saying the opposite I’m not beauty in the sense of physical beauty but but beauty the sense of of you know ownership who who you know he calls you his not ownership in the master slave type of. You know vocabulary you know this is woke you know Usa but so theres there’s that piece too I think that is worth digging into I don’t I I don’t put a lot of weight in how I view myself in general. Um, you know, um.

Andrew – Um, yeah.

Andrew – Be clear. No.

Josh – It’s not. It’s not helpful I think and and often unless it’s detrimental to your behavior or your goals or whatever you’re trying to get to so like if you’re not confident in chasing something dig into that and figure out why? what’s what’s what’s causing that What are the insecurities that are at play here if you’re leading people damn.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – If you’re leading people. You’re a manager of some sort. You’re a pastor. You’re a a ministry leader you’re wherever you you fall like holy crap deal with your crap I don’t know if you’ve ever worked for an insecure leader but it’s miserable miserable like there’s nothing worse I think yeah.

Andrew – Um, yeah, it gets magnified big time. Yeah.

Josh – Um, and emotions are all over the board. You don’t know where to sit in things as the subordinate because you know nothing seems to make sense until you start to realize? no, they’re reacting from their insecurities like deal with these things identify them talk to Jesus about them figure out ways to overcome them figure out the things that trigger them. Um, so you can be aware of them when they start to show up like pay attention to this stuff and find community that could be honest about them is is definitely worth it. But I think we’ve taken enough side tracks with this specific question. Let’s let’s move to the next one and this is using the Junto Institute I think I pronounced that right.

Andrew – Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, and.

Josh – Um, their feeling wheel and apparently this is I’ve never seen it before but this is a big thing inside of the counseling community.

Andrew – Yeah, this is ah it’s a tool that can be used in ah in therapy like it’s ah like to like sometimes help people identify like hey how are you really feeling like how do we put words to that and like. You know it’s a tool that can be used in a lot of ways. It’s funny like Jana happened to show me this like I don’t know maybe six months ago um for ah for not counseling but for work I do where it’s all about like hey how does our customer feel at this point you know and was looking for like good.

Josh – Um, yeah, yeah.

Andrew – Varieties of feeling language and she’s like have you ever looked at feeling wheels and anyway it made me laugh that this is part of it. But yeah man, the question. Yeah yeah.

Josh – So I think the way that feeling wheels work if you if it will link this ah on our show notes at this Jesus Http:// for this episode. But I think the way the work is you spin them right? And then you put your finger on something and whatever that is. That’s your That’s your spot like supposed feeling. It’s like a mood ring kind of thing.

Andrew – And I don’t know I don’t know I don’t think it’s meant to be a mood ring. No, it’s like it’s like categories of feeling like hey like this like yeah yeah, yeah, yeah.

Josh – Ah, no, no essentially it’s yeah I don’t know how to I don’t know how to describe it, you’re gonna have to look them up if you’re if you’re listening but essentially it’s 3 rings and around those rings the emotions. Um.

Andrew – You.

Josh – Ah, essentially you’re getting to core emotions. Love Fear Anger sadness surprise and joy and then there’s a ring outside of that to kind of narrow down a little bit more on a ring outside of that to narrow down a little more this is helpful for me to like connect things right? like anxious goes to speaks to a fear I know I’m speaking of.

Andrew – Um, yeah, yeah, um.

Andrew – Yeah.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – Common sense things but you know helplessness usually comes back to a fear dreadfulness usually comes back to fear or you know switching categories irritated frustrated aggravated resentful envious coming all from Anger disappointed Shameful lonely.

Andrew – Yeah, yep.

Josh – You know, digging into sadness moved touched stimulated ah speechless Awstruck you know, working back to surprise Zealous Hopeful eager, playful amused, cheerful optimistic coming back to joy.

Andrew – Yeah, so.

Andrew – Right? right.

Andrew – Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Josh – And then of course the love category but kind of use it and I think we circle back around to this again at some point in the conversation. But um, you know how do you as you look at these to put essentially were trying to put words to ah an emotion. Um, so for me I’m not at a super emotional guy. This scenario got working On. With me right now because it’s really hard to show empathy to people if you can’t connect their emotion to an emotion that you’ve experienced of the same right for similar, you know if I can’t identify that you know they’re feeling whatever. So for me I I work from the outside in.

Andrew – Great you.

Josh – From the inside out sorry because I have less vocabulary around emotions than than the wheel would provide so Anger fear. Love Joy Surprise I can identify those from a big perspective but giving you like smaller. So let’s get to the smaller I think.

Andrew – That’s funny. yeah helpful though yeah me right ah yeah yeah I um dude I was looking at this because I knew we’re going to talk about it and and I do now have my younger daughter in my office Janna is out pulling weeds in the garden.

Josh – Of how do you think god feels about you. You want to go first.

Josh – Getting that tomato Marijuana plant going. She got to get it ready.

Andrew – My Older daughter’s napping. Still.. It’s right? No. So anyway, there might be who knows about Distractions we’ll see but right now she’s E mangos but dude as I look at this the one that stood out most. Um. Compassionate. Um, and that’s in the love category and it’s on the outside of the wheel and and I don’t know why that struck me except that like when you’re Compassionate. It’s like that combination of like. Have real deep care for you and I feel empathy for whatever is going on in your life like but it’s like empathy in action you know and I don’t know like I I Just think God is likequeued in to what’s going on in my life.

Josh – Um, yeah.

Andrew – And and the lives of each person around me so she’s now doing a mango dance and singing in the background. But yeah man compassionate. That’s what that’s what really struck me back in one moment I’m sorry for the quick pause.

Josh – Um, yeah.

Josh – Um, you know I think too like I’m looking at these words of like enthralled which by the way good word enthralled um is God yeah.

Andrew – I $5 word right? there.

Josh – Intellectually I could say yeah God is it’s an emotion of love passionate an emotion of love. Um, but I feel but I feel inadequate for those emotions from god.

Andrew – Um, yeah.

Andrew – Who.

Josh – Like I don’t feel like I deserve them. Um and that’s going back to does God Love you because of who you are does God Love you because you’re his like God God’s passionate and thrilled by you because of your his like it’s based off his character that those emotions come to, you know, come true for him. Um, rather than your.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – Behavior or your ability or your um engagement or your whatever So like those are things where you like live and you know you know we all have those things like we know something to be true, but we don’t necessarily experience or feel it. But.

Andrew – So right.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – Like it’s true or hopeful. You know jubilant there’s another $5 word I would say are all true of of god’s view of me. Um, and of my life. But um I don’t feel like I know them to be true. But I don’t feel them.

Andrew – That’s right. Um, yeah.

Andrew – Um, yeah, and I think that’s probably why I picked compassionate man because I’m like I know God loves me you know because of.

Josh – You know it’s fair to to use those terminology. Um like I wouldn’t live in the yeah.

Andrew – Not just like the stuff that the bible says but also like my lived experience I’m like yeah I can tell one I can tell like that there is an enemy of us Satan who hates us doesn’t want to see good for Us. Think a lot of us can see that maybe easier than we can see the love of God because there’s just so much messed up stuff that happens in life where you’re like yeah, something’s working against me, you know or someone’s working against me but the the love side like man I’ve I’ve just experienced some.

Josh – Yeah, yeah.

Andrew – Amazing things in this life and I’m just like Wow God like God loves us like that is the default is deep set Love That’s a major attribute of God that you read about in the bible that but I’ve also experienced in a lot of ways. But. Yeah, like Jubilant and like that type of word I’m like I don’t know like I don’t go like I don’t go as quickly to that like reckless love as as I could but compassionate like I can understand that because it’s like fully loving but like levelheaded. Ah, guess is how I would understand compassionate like I’m like I Love you I empathize with what’s going on but I’m looking at it and understanding it on a head level and a heart level. Not just ah I’m super analytical and distant or I’m I’m all hard and no action like I think God is.

Josh – Sure.

Andrew – Compassionate towards me like that that blend of like I see it I understand it and I’m I’m actively thinking about it and feeling it too. You know So anyway yeah man that’s what I think.

Josh – Yeah, yeah, it’s a little hard like when I was reading I was reading up on. you know you know Jesus being fully god and fully man and Jesus limiting his divinity to to fully ah embrace his humanity um over this last week. Im trying to remember where I was reading that stuff one of our deyship tools but reading through that stuff and just kind of processing it of like god would have experienced all these emotions in general. So like you know Jesus experienced anger. He experienced sadness experienced fear. Um. Because he was fully human and knowing comfort that like you know sure this specific questions like how does god feel about you? Um, but like I find comfort in the fact that god can like he can show empathy in all of these areas because he’s experienced as a human. All of these emotions so like he can connect with me on those levels that kind of as I just read through all these different emotions and like process through how Jesus may have felt annoyed or worried as he lived this life probably didn’t feel a lot of guilt in the sadness category. But.

Andrew – Yeah.

Andrew – I right? big time I dude wait hey on that guilt thing can I take a real quick rabbit trail and I know we probably only have 5 or ten more minutes because we’re already close to an hour

Josh – Probably understood how others felt guilt to some extent the shame that came along with it. But um, yeah I don’t I think the next question probably.

Andrew – And our old producer and friend used to yell at us whenever we went over an hour so Stewart we love you I sorry if we break an hour man but you’re no longer helping. So hopefully you’re listening ah but but yeah I think Jesus totally understood guilt even if he didn’t feel it of like. I hurt somebody I sin against somebody and I feel guilty of that like man the way I was reading about Zachaius to my daughter last night and like Zachaius was a tax collector who had no no I didn’t but I read her like children’s bible version of it and.

Josh – Did you sing the song.

Andrew – You know like Zachius felt guilt at like he he wanted to see Jesus and wanted to get to know him but like thought man like I’m this unworthy short tax collector. The best I could hope to do is like get a view of him from a tree you know and then Jesus walks under the tree at least in the children’s. Book version I read the real story in a long time but he are the adult version in a long time. But Jesus basically calls up to out to him and is like Zaius I’m coming to your house for lunch man like climb down. We’re going to your place and from there. Zakis feels the guilt of like this is what I’ve done like it’s like his reason to like jump into action and like revolutionize the way he lives as a tax collector and like give back even more to those who he robbed in the past or who he charged extra on their taxes you know because he could. But it’s like yeah man Jesus understands guilt even if he didn’t live guilt from a place of sin like you and I might have for like like I sure have and like you probably have to so anyway men random tangent that struck me that ah you know, just wanted to throw out there.

Josh – Um, yeah.

Josh – Yeah.

Andrew – But 1 other thought man um, there’s a supporting verse around this conversation and it feels real appropriate because it’s almost Easter um John 1513 says greater love has no one. Then this that someone lay down his life for his friends and man. The beautiful thing is like Jesus did that you know like the disciples weren’t his workplace associates. They weren’t his like distant zealot followers like. Jesus knew them as friends you know and and he chose to lay down his life. Not just because like god willed it and god told him like yes, do this but and gave him that mission but because he’s like no I’m saving my friends like I’m going to go and take the brunt of this for you. and and I think I think that’s how he views us too is like I’m your friend let come here I’m here for you and I sacrificed for you but I want you to live knowing that you know I don’t want you to live distantly. So. I’m gonna mute cause this one’s getting loud but wanted to call those things out for sure.

Josh – Yeah, yeah, this next question is how do you feel about god and I think yeah, we manipulated the first question and kind of talk through that already. Um, so won’t we don’t think we need to dig into it again. But you know. Connecting those particular feelings to a belief or an understanding about god I think is probably where this becomes a helpful conversation. Um like it. It probably pretty good practice. Um for you to pull out a notebook. Um and just start like writing down the characteristics of god.

Andrew – I yeah.

Josh – Um, that you understand or that you know or can identify um, not not Google it don’t like don’t um, you know, find some lists and like work through it of these are this is who what scripture says god is or this how god is defended by you know, um, identified himself or. But like just start writing those down and um I think it’d be good practice to like look at that list and compare it to like your feelings about god and how you engage and interact with god um, you know it’d be worth like you know statistics tell us that most people don’t spend time with Jesus.

Andrew – Yeah.

Josh – That are professed christians like it’s it’s a low number unfortunately but like like that’s where life comes in like you know I talk about John 1010 you know Jesus came to give us life and give it to the full like full life comes from relationship with Jesus and late relationship with people. Um, that’s why Jesus went to the cross is to restore these things.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – Um, back to their original you know intent and that’s a process so we call sanctification um to restore those things but like if if you find yourself not spending a lot of time with God It’d be worth digging into why because I don’t think it’s your laziness though it may play some small rule. And I don’t think it’s like your unwillingness to do these things I think I think you just don’t like him. Um, and I think that’s probably at some source of misunderstanding or misbelief of who God really is um like if you if you’re if you’re looking at this and say like God is angry at Me. He’s annoyed by me.

Andrew – And.

Andrew – Yeah.

Josh – He’s resentful towards me because of like my own actions like he’s justified like you’re you’re looking at saying Well he’s justified in those actions but the reality is if if that’s how you view God is viewing you like you’re not going to want to spend any time with him. Um, so like I think question four here is is huge.

Andrew – Right? so.

Josh – In terms of like if you’re not spending time with Jesus you yeah, you should figure out why because my guess is you don’t like something about his character um not like not head knowledge stuff like you know you know what scripture says about you know how god views you and what god has done for you and the sacrifice that Jesus made for you like. From a head knowledge perspective. You can connect all those things and be like no, we’re good. But I think it’s worth the deep dive to really figure out these emotions of like how does god feel about you and how do you feel about god and what emotion can I attach to those things and maybe it’s practicing throughout the week um when you feel an emotion like connecting with why? Why am I feeling.

Andrew – The right? and.

Josh – Whatever I’m feeling or what I’m thinking about or like most christians probably go through their entire week and like other than praying in their meals and let’s be honest, even prayer in the meals. It’s it’s a habit. It’s nothing to do with actually talking with god um, for most people that like until you come back to church that next Sunday you probably. Maybe he thought about god if we’re lucky once and it wasn’t even necessarily like a thought like with god it was just about him. Um, and then even in sermons like maybe it’s you’re just thinking through like all the ways that you need to change and fix yourself and um, you know.

Andrew – And.

Josh – Yeah, all the ways you got to do it on your own where Jesus is like no no, no like you’re missing the point like I just want to know you and I want to be known by you and I want to live inside of this thing so we can walk together and you can see a level of growth in your character and in your joy and in your hope for your future that you never thought possible.

Andrew – Hit.

Andrew – You know.

Josh – Want to teach you How to experience those things but I think a big piece of that is we have I don’t want to say wrong wrong emotions because there’s potentially we have with the right emotion that God has towards us. But um I think oftentimes we don’t but I don’t want to say we never do. But I think.

Andrew – Um.

Josh – We just don’t like God and I think that’s a big piece of of why we don’t spend any time with it because I don’t know about you but like when you’re newly in love with somebody. Um like and you’re infatuated by that person you want to you want to be around of all the time. Um, you want to know everything about them.

Andrew – Are you. Totally.

Josh – Um, you want to engage them and spend as much time as you possibly can with them. But that’s not the norm for most christians in their relationship with God and I would argue it’s because you don’t like him. There’s some character piece of of that you’ve equated to him that um or a motion piece that you’ve equated to him That’s just not true of him. Um, and it’s it’s worth digging into and talking about and having those conversations which probably are going to feel vulnerable and hard with God Maybe it’s a past experience you had with the church. They harmed you in some way and you’ve blamed God for those experiences. Um you know, have those hard conversations. Not gonna be fun.

Andrew – So yeah I.

Josh – But it’d be worth it. But I think yeah, not saying told me Jesus is probably worth an investigation on your own to figure out why? Why do you not want to maybe it’s the feeling of he’s distant I don’t know it could be a thousand different things probably for everybody. But. Um, it’s it’s kind of the key to this conversation I didn’t know this conversation is for Andrew and I to get to know each other more and then model this but from the god perspective I think this is worth digging into because you know this is why we exist you know this news light podcast.

Andrew – Um, yeah, yeah.

Josh – We like to talk about funny fart things and whatever else comes to mind as you know the 12 year old inner boys that we actually are but there’s also this piece of like we want to teach people how to foster relationship with god and foster relationship with people and become experts at it. You know as as christians there should be no one on this planet.

Andrew – Right.

Josh – Do relationship better. Um, you know both in the spiritual realm and in the physical realm. But I think until we’re willing to dig into the probably hard pieces of life. Um, and really evaluate like man. Maybe I just. Maybe I actually don’t love Jesus as much as I I like to think that I do because I I don’t really want to spend a lot of time with him like if those are the thoughts running through your head I think those are thoughts we’re digging into I would say are essential to your next.

Andrew – Yeah, big time and then do that simple framework of like how does what is God thinking about me, you know, guess at it. What does God feel about me guess at it like then what am I thinking about God What do I feel towards god.

Josh – You know.

Andrew – Like that is such a good framework to use to have a conversation like we just did but also just as a way to pray like start there if you’re listening to that. That’s ah, that’s a great way to do it and I’m going to try to do that this week of like what is god thinking about me. What’s he feeling towards me. What am I thinking about him what am I feeling towards him. It’s like that’s that’s a great point to get the conversation started so all I’m trying to say so if you want something practical, go with that like that’s that’s going to be only a good framework to start some conversations you might need to have. With god this week. So um, brother I gotta tell you things are getting a little bit hairy on this side my one year old is diving and trying to get everything off my desk as I hold her half upside down and she gets posted notes in this moment but but this has been awesome. So before I go on mute. Thank you for for doing this conversation again. Josh I’m looking forward to the next ones it’s gonna be great man.

Josh – Yeah, no thank you? Um, you is and and we’ll continue this. You know there’s 10 conversations inside of this series. This was our third things start to get progressively I don’t know if deeper is the right word or vulnerable is the right word but they’re they’re going to get a little bit harder for us to practice. Um, moving forward when we start to talk ah you know next week we talk about you know our home life and you know the security we find there and or found or didn’t find there depending on you know our stories um and digging into those things and we’ll try to do our best to be as vulnerable but like let’s be honest, you know. Parents and siblings listen to our podcast. So and we don’t want to paint them in a light. That’s not fair to them. But we’re gonna we’re gonna do our best I don’t even know what my answers are I’m just assuming you start talking about home life and there’s gonna be things that someone would rather you have not shared. But yeah, so keep.

Andrew – We’re going to try to model it in a reasonable way. Yeah, yeah.

Josh – Keep with us keep going down this. Um this path with us in this series If you hadn’t had a chance to to grab the tools. Um, we’ll post them in the show notes at this Ju’s live podcast and get you linked over to true life and maybe there’s someone in your life that you can walk through so you can be fully done and. Be know for someone fully as well walkthrough with your spouse walkthrough with a trusted friend.

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