“Follow me,” he told them, “and I will make you fish for people” Matthew 4:19 (CSB). We continue our series about Church Words you’ve probably heard and the meaning behind them. What did Jesus mean when He said “fish for people”? We talking about the mission of all Christians.
Josh – Hello hello hello hello we’re just 2 normal dudes trying to live this jesus life. My name’s Josh.
Andrew – Hey how me Andrew and we are this jesus life podcast Josh we are 76 episodes in and we nailed the intro. We nailed the intro. Oh.
Josh – Crazy talk. We did. We nailed it now as I was yeah well as I was going through the intro I couldn’t get this phrase out of my head and.
Andrew – Hilarial is hilariously on the seventy fifth we did not but but we got it on this one? yeah. M.
Josh – Would just like you give some context to it. But right before we started the podcast you said hey Josh I’ll be right back I have to go scare my daughter um and was like oh cool, fun have fun.
Andrew – Ah, yeah, ah yeah, well, they’re three year olds are crazy people and I mean like I have to the start of quiet time is always like a. Ridiculous hostage negotiation for her to just stay in her room and do fun things and eat a snack and look at books like she loves quiet time but you have to like negotiate way harder than you should to start it and then at some point if she’s being crazy like she was. Have to scare her like if you come out of your room I will take away all your favorite toys. You will have nose neck like that’s so that’s what I was doing I was making threats that I don’t actually want to carry out at all I will but I don’t want to.
Josh – Um.
Josh – So like in your in your threats like is it the tone that you use. Do you like act like you’re taking off your belt like what are the threats that are coming across in this moment.
Andrew – No, no, no, it’s just tone. It’s like oh shoot dad is not messing around. He will take my snack away from me. He will take all these things follow through tuned like every day in life.
Josh – Has she ever gotten have you ever had to like like fulfill the threat. Yeah no because the second you don’t your kid owns you like he they’ve won.
Andrew – Every day not not every day at quiet time. Yes, exactly not every day at quiet time but every day I have to like make a threat and follow through and it’s always dramatic but I always have to remind her like I told you you could not do that or this would happen. So. Yeah man this this threat was taking away the play phone. It’s not connected to like wi-fi or anything like that. It’s just like a phone with buttons. You can push that makes lightup sounds and stuff I’m like if you come out of your room 1 more time before that lights green I’m taking that phone away and that would be yeah.
Josh – That’s funny.
Josh – Yeah, yeah.
Josh – Snapping and laughing.
Andrew – But I also said if you wake your sister up I’m also taking that phone away. Yeah yeah man So I don’t know parenting is a trip you know.
Josh – That’s funny. You know it’s crazy to think like you think like all the ways that you used to work your parents over ah and like you’re not that smart. You’re a child but it worked you just think like all the ways that your kid probably is working you over and you don’t even know it now.
Andrew – Yeah.
Andrew – Um, sister the ah.
Josh – Like my mom used to ground us like especially like middle school from the internet or for our computers and she would take the power cable or like she would change the Aol login I know I’m dating myself yet and when I was in middle school. We’re in even high school. We were connecting the internet through Aol ding you’ve got mail. Um and the mode of bra or trauma.
Andrew – Or your brammer. Okay, just.
Josh – He don’t know anything about dude that brings me another thing that I read today but I’ll bring it up in just a second. Ah but like we used to ah, we used to like mom. We called my mom but hey mom what’s the Aol password so we can sign in I have schoolwork to do. But she should have known right off the bat that was a lie because I never did schoolwork like I never did my homework I just figured how to pass classes without doing my homework. Um, but yeah, every time she be like oh it’s this and then she would forget or like she would ground us from like music and stuff and I’d like mom can I listen to my christian music.
Andrew – On the phone.
Andrew – Thing.
Josh – Like you want me to like be close to Jesus right? and that would like get me in and she is another difference in Christian Christian music um yeah it was like how do I work my mom over to get what I want in this moment but just sound like a good child I’m giving all my mom my secrets now but dude so here’s another thing.
Andrew – Um, and then.
Andrew – Man Yeah I already see. Yeah, what’s the other thing. What’s the other thing. Yeah, yeah.
Josh – So I was thinking of the modem sound that you know kids today have no idea what that sound is and then I was reading an article today I guess there’s some Tiktok trend or whatever’s popular these days ah about um. Learning what the there’s like heights on doors at like retail or like fast food restaurants like ah you know you five foot six foot and nobody knows what that stands for so like it’s the whole you know today I learn that this is for you know robbers I just thought was there. You know to help me.
Andrew – Okay, yeah.
Andrew – Um.
Josh – You know, fun thing to know how tall it was like that’s okay is things like that. Really how do you not know this stuff. Um, and then someone also made a comment this morning of music being you know I like their old stuff from like 2006 and I was like what 2006 is
Andrew – What that’s crazy. Yeah.
Andrew – Ah, yeah, ah, but still funny.
Josh – Not old like what the heck and then someone reminded me that they would have been in. Yeah, they would have been in ah preschooler like early elementary school in 2006 and then I was like um so old this is sad.
Andrew – Wow Dude that that’s insane. That’s insane. We are old I mean we’re just old people Now you know getting all shrively um, needing to wear you know? ah.
Josh – I’m not believing that shrively are you shriveling were you shriveling dude is that what you worry about Andrew as you’re getting old like where you shrive like.
Andrew – No, not really um I don’t know I was just ah.
Andrew – Ah I don’t know I don’t I dude I don’t know why I said shrivally at all I was thinking about what what makes an old person look like an old person.
Josh – That’s your biggest old fears like I’m going to shrivel up and die it’s getting my fingers and then.
Josh – The.
Andrew – But I’m not how shrivally are you are you pretty shrively. Yeah anyway, dude yeah I Yeah I Just don’t even care to know like what the most recent social media Trends and stuff are um even to the point where.
Josh – It’s the shrively I I Yeah I think it’s a shrively to I’m with you no offense to old people that maybe shriveling up right now.
Andrew – I don’t know I’m just out of the loop. But I like I said I’m on like police duty for tiny crazy people all the time. So if I let my guard down and start looking at Instagram or Facebook or anywhere else. The the happenings are happening. Um.
Josh – That’s where.
Andrew – Things go off the rails then I have to threaten to take away things that are tiny crazy people. Love the most. But ah I don’t know man parenting is a trip and we’re old and and speaking of old. What is the what is the 1 thing you do.
Josh – So sad.
Andrew – That you’re like yeah this is a straight up old man habit and I’m glad I do it like that you do currently um I know we’ve been through like avoiding pink eye you know and being scared of that and all your morning routines. Um.
Josh – That’s on old Man habit that should be a practice for everybody. Nobody wants pink high.
Andrew – Ah, but what? what’s like an old man habit that you’re just you own. You know you’re you’re happy about it.
Josh – Man An old man habit I’m happy about that’s hard. No, but there’s that movie I Just saw it come up on my plex which is what stores all my movies. Um.
Andrew – Yeah, yeah, do you ever go like feed birds at the park or you know.
Andrew – And women.
Josh – Going out in style. We’ve talked about this on the podcast before but it’s a bunch of old guys like Morgan Freeman and a couple other guys and they’re like playing back orat or something in the park. Whatever you do with the balls I think it’s called back at I know I think that’s a table game but I might making that up.
Andrew – Yeah, back game and back came in anyway.
Josh – Um, but they yeah they’re just sitting there complaining about life like complaining about young kids and you know all stupid stuff that people do and I’m just like man. That’s what I aspire to be in life where you’re like it’s socially acceptable just to like judge and and be like a crabby old man that’d be fun.
Andrew – So you’re just aspiring towards it. You’re aspiring towards it. Yeah, that’s fair, Um, yeah.
Josh – Um, do it yet. But yeah like I just we’re just like they’re like yeah, he’s old. He’s deserves. It. Let him let him get away with talking shit about people. He doesn’t know. Um, but yeah I don’t I don’t know I mean all things I do. Probably do a lot more old things. This is a question you ask like younger people that see you on a regular basis like what old things do I do but I was telling someone this morningrn and like I still act like a 12 year old kid when you’re talking about. We’re talking about that a recent podcast about butt cheeks which was about turning the other cheek. Um.
Andrew – Yeah. Right? Yeah,, That’s true.
Andrew – In.
Josh – And this guy was telling his wife about it and he said oh they’re talking about turning the other cheek and his wife’s response was how long did it take Josh to talk about butt cheeks. Well I’ve talked about butts I think it’s actually themed it and he’s like ah less less than 20 seconds know they? yeah.
Andrew – With it. Um, so I mean we we look like adults. But yeah.
Josh – We look like adults but we’re really just 12 year old boys stuck in adult bodies. Things are still funny farting. Still funny. Yeah.
Andrew – Yeah, as you know my wife came in right before we started the podcast and like are you just in your farting the whole hallway smells terrible. So I I didn’t do anything about it except close my door and giggle. Um and tell the world via podcast.
Josh – Ah, you have to giggle that just comes with the world. Yeah, like you got to giggle what what old things. Do you do? Andrew.
Andrew – So I mean yeah, yeah, we look like adults but we’re twelve year olds at heart. Oh man. Yeah I don’t know it is a particularly hard question. Um I do a spy I okay, old man thing. I collect tools as much as possible like I’m just always trying to get more good tools and and stocking up and I get really annoyed if somebody moves my tools and doesn’t put them back in the exact right spot.
Josh – Yeah, that is an old nan thing. Ah.
Andrew – That’s totally the old man thing like like dude you want to really bother me gosh if somebody comes just like shift Shofs like moves things around from 1 counter to the other in my garage where they should be like dude that i.
Josh – Ah, my stepdad used to get so pissed at me.
Josh – Ah, that’s body.
Andrew – It gets straight up mad because I feel like I’m so busy that when I finally get a chance to use my tools for something they better be where I left them. You know like him on. So yeah, that’s an old man thing through and through yeah yeah, man.
Josh – That’s funny. That’s pretty good I was I had breakfast this morning like stupid early like before the sun shows up and we went to a place where a bunch of old people go I’m actually doing it again tomorrow with with a different ah buddy. But.
Andrew – 1 vote.
Andrew – Nice.
Josh – Um, like there’s that thing of like yeah I want to be an old man that’s ir regularular at like a diner and like you always have your same place and your your waitress just comes up and like gives you your food without ordering I have that at Starbucks depending on who’s at the window but it’s not. It’s not the same. It’s not the same diner feel where you’re like I’m known in this place.
Andrew – Yeah, that’d be cool. Yeah.
Andrew – Um, yes.
Josh – Like that whole Cheers episode where you know what’s the guy’s name shoot they used to yell his name when he came into the restaurant. Um, gosh he’s the dude. Ah he’s the guy from the um.
Andrew – Um I don’t know I don’t know.
Josh – Ah, Snl skit that goes du bears dull bears du bears du bears stop bears whatever that guy’s name is but whatever isn yeah I know name. Yeah I don’t I didn’t watch any of those shows but I definitely watched um welcome back Carter I love Lucy.
Andrew – Oh I know who you mean I don’t know his name though.
Josh – The odd couple like that whole crew on what is it called Nick at night when Nickelodeon turned into old people Tv I used to love all those shows watched them on a pretty regular basis. Um, but I’m also also had an executive desk in my room as a child. We talked about last episode which is strange enough as it is um, but Andrew is I think going to go threaten his daughter again I’m not really sure he took off. He did like the 1 finger thing. Um, but we’re in the middle of this series. We’re talking. We’re we’re calling it church words um, just like church sayings that you hear on a regular regular basis from church people and you know what’s what’s the meaning behind it. What does it mean? Um, we’ve kind of spent most of our time talking about. Um. Um, things that Jesus said so far but we’ll probably add some other ones in there to you. We talked about turning the other cheek ah was without no, you didn’t beat your daughter sorry threaten your daughter or no, you.
Andrew – Nope.
Andrew – No, no, no major threats. No I was just ve detailing. You said we might say some things that Jesus students say and I said nope nope not at all. Ah just get.
Josh – You should just go into a room and fart or fart right outside her door to like keep her in her room. It sounds like they’re pretty. They’re pretty potent today.
Andrew – Ah, a fart barrier. Ah, they are They are anyway sorry to interrupt your great train of thought with that. Yeah, what.
Josh – Um, you ah have learned though. So I’ve been eating I mean and by this I mean like a shit ton of hummus like I don’t know how much hummus I’ve eaten in the last two weeks but it has been a lot of hummus.
Andrew – Um, students. Ah.
Josh – And Hummus apparently gives me gas doesn’t smell at least I don’t smell it. It might smell I guess I wouldn’t know ah but it is loud and it creates a lot of air I don’t know what it is chickpea is that a thing.
Andrew – Ah, it’s dude. It’s chickpeas. It’s hummus is and basically it’s yeah yeah, hummus is made out of chickpeas mainly and tahini sauce Teeny based Yeah yeah.
Josh – Um I didn’t know chickpeas were like like a thing.
Andrew – That’s it’s like basically a bean so you’re just eating a ton of beans as a paste for quick fart production Anyway, totally. Ah.
Josh – That’s it. Yeah, but dude dude to my extra regular like I’m one of those guys that like feels good about myself if I poop every other day I’m like this is pretty good. Ah pooping every morning at the same time win like.
Andrew – Ah, oh man.
Josh – All day long that is a win pooping more than once in a day I’m freaking hitting Grand Slam home runs on the regular and chickpeas Dude Grand Slams on the regular I feel accomplished because there’s nothing. We talked about this for a podcast like there’s no.
Andrew – Um, dude I’m still um I’m so happy for you right? Yeah, it’s a satisfying.
Josh – Better than a long pee or a good poop like you just feel accomplished if you can start that for the day and.
Andrew – It’s a satisfying thing. It’s a good. It’s how everybody wants to start their day where you’re not rushed. You have a good long time and you’re productive. You know it works Dude I like I like how I I come in.
Josh – Um, yeah, yeah, exactly like put that on your should do list of good poop Check Winner Winner Chicken dinner.
Andrew – I say 1 thing and you’re immediately back on poop but hummus man this will get you there like it is I know and I’m giggling along this whole time because it’s so true.
Josh – I told you we’re 12 year old boys.
Josh – Ah, do I Love pizza.
Andrew – Like I’ve been eating a steady diet of of pizza and pasta because we had my daughter’s first birthday this weekend and we got we catered or we got a bunch of food from an italian place. So it’s like really great pasta. Really great pizza followed up with some awesome cupcakes and yeah man. Ah, been very rigged I’ve been grand slamming as well one could say so.
Josh – Dude graying slam away I’ve been eating I’ve been making pizzas at home using Non is that you pronounce it bread excuse me like the Indian bread Dude so good. It’s like perfect like personal pizza sizes So tasty. Lots of those.
Andrew – Yes, yes, that’s what the. So Good. So good Dude That’s what’s up Anyways, that was our tangent I’m back I’m back. Um.
Josh – But right back on topic since Andrew distracted us with poop talk like a child. Um, um, so this week we’re gonna kind of continue this theme talking about church things and you may have heard this quoted before you may have heard sermons on this Someone’s made told you this. But. Ah, Jesus says this in Matthew four. He says come follow me and I will make you fishers of men which in all honesty like is weird. That’s a weird thing to say to somebody like go fish for people buddy like that’s what I want you to do? It’s kind of like.
Andrew – That’s right. Right.
Josh – It’s probably going too far but it’s funny so we’ll go with it. It’s like you’re like trying to find like dudes like you’re just going to the clubs like I’m will find me some man I don’t think that’s what Jesus means here. But that’s what I first read maybe it says more about me than I like to like to admit.
Andrew – I I don’t think I also don’t I also don’t think they thought that’s what he meant I don’t think they’re like that. There’s a chance but I’m gonna go with it I think they were like okay like we get it. You know where because they knew he was a rabbi or they knew he was a teacher I don’t know Rabbi is that an official rank or are you just a teacher anyway, that’s a tangent rabbi means teacher all right? So they knew.
Josh – And they knew they were. They would mean that it the word means the same thing I don’t I don’t think there’s like a ranking system. Yeah people that follow you would you’d be right.
Andrew – They knew he was a teacher so and they were like the Lowly fishermen So when he said come follow me I’ll make you fishers a men I’m sure they’re like oh like you want to disciple us you want us to I don’t even know if they would have said disciple you want to apprentice us. Like you want us to become teachers like this is crazy. Okay, like yeah.
Josh – Yeah, well I think too I think the weird thing though is like even if you’re teachers of men like Jewish custom isn’t to reach people like they didn’t evangelize that wasn’t a thing.
Andrew – Truth true right.
Josh – Um, they still don’t evangelize in a lot of ways they’re hostile to the idea of evangelism drastically different than christianity but like so even like that idea of like there’s probably so many questions in that moment like hear they’re fishing like this is this is said to Simon Peter and his brother. Um, while they were getting out of a boat. So like.
Andrew – Um, yeah, um.
Josh – Relate to the fisherman side but there’s got to be like like come follow me like just drop it all just like and and follow me about this idea that I’m not even for sure what it means like when you you fish for people which maybe it was exciting to them I like I like to throw some nets at some people like which is gonna like Cruise through. You know downtown jerusalem and just like net people like that sounds fun. Ah then they got disappointed by. Yeah I say I don’t know if that’s assault today, but it’d be worth looking into to see if it’s it’s you know? ah.
Andrew – Ah, good checking I Do I’m good with the net I’m I’m good with the net. We can met some people. Yeah yeah, totally. And.
Andrew – You know I think with all the movies and things if you throw a net on a person today. They’re like I have to fight for my life because I’m about to be murdered in some crazy way like it’s not a good call to you know.
Josh – Legally okay to go around throwing nets on people.
Josh – Um, that’s fair like if I got netted when I was walking. Yeah, that would be my first thought like this is not going to end well, that’s fair imagine going to the grocery store and you’re just like walking down the milk aisle trying to find milk and just a net drops on you.
Andrew – Um, you know I am going to fight as hard as I possibly can that’ here that’s terrifying moment.
Josh – Yeah, that’s a moment that’s gonna it’s gonna mess with you. Yeah, that’s fair, you can’t struggle like if you struggled like it just gets worse. You can’t struggle in a net you got to be intentional and and.
Andrew – Oh man I can’t imagine that and I can’t imagine what I would do but I feel like that’s like an impractical joker thing it sps you got to.
Josh – And slow take it off or you just get tangled that more man. There’s so many so many tangents.
Andrew – Dude you sound like somebody who has been caught by somebody who is a fisher of men before like you sound like you’ve been in this scenario I was just going for the I was going for the 2% and
Josh – Even fishermen don’t use nets anymore or he’s not to catch the fish.
Andrew – Um, and so funny. Ah so good. So great. Take us back man take us back on track. Ah now that we’re all in the grocery store. Yeah yeah.
Josh – Well well let me let me ask you this Andrew because I think this helps this response from Jesus helps the answers answer this question. Um, so I’ll set you up for it. Put it on I’ll put it on the the t and you knock this ball out of the park.
Andrew – Okay, um.
Josh – On a tball field. So It’s like really just the Infield. You don’t have to hit it that far and you and you’ve hit a home run I don’t think I’ve ever hit a home run even in tball in my life which I feel like a loser about so don’m bringing it up. Um, what’s the point of christianity like what. We’re supposed to do with this thing. What’s our mission.
Andrew – Yeah to make disciples of of people and but but not only to make disciples but to be a disciple of the way of Jesus like to follow in the way he followed to walk in the way he walked. To to live out the things that he taught and to do it authentically like it is what we talk about a lot you know and I don’t know if that’d be a t-ball home run or an infield hit but I hit it off the it’s off the t. That’s for sure. But. Dude yeah to to like to be discipled and to make disciples and that’s not necessarily sometimes it’s a formal process but I just mean to like truly be a follower of the way of Christ like to live it out authentically in each aspect of your life. Which takes time and effort and work and commitment and like you got to believe it’s true or you’re going to give up on that. Um, but it’s it’s a radical shift between not following god or following a different way and then shifting and following. The god and living out the way of of kind of how Jesus lived so I don’t know we we talk about this so often on this show or so maybe we throw it in so often. But we don’t directly talk about it. This much. But I think to try to be like Jesus that is our that’s our mo like and that’s for us living it out authentically in our lives and also in those around us trying to disciple and make disciples. So yeah, man, that’s that’s my That’s my infield hit at least what would you add to that.
Josh – No, it’s great I think solid connection to the ball um didn’t hit the T at all line drive going over the fence and again the fence is at the infield line so wasn’t that. Ah.
Andrew – Ah, nice, beautiful. Ah, beautiful, right? right? great.
Josh – Ah, no, that’s great and I think Jesus summed it up. You know we looked as disciples in Matthew 28 we call this the great commission you looked at them right before sending into heaven and said you know all authority in heaven and earth and given to me therefore go and make disciples of all nations baptizing them and they are the father the son the holy spirit.
Andrew – That.
Andrew – Yep.
Josh – Teaching them to obey everything I’ve commanded you and surely I’m with you always to the very end of the age this is and this is what they were commissioned to do after walking with Jesus for 3 years as he prepared them for this work and I don’t think that’s changed. You know two thousand plus years later um we’re still um.
Andrew – End of the h.
Josh – Chasing the same thing with a new harvest of people. Um, as we you know, try to help and and it’s not because we want to necessarily grow christianity or it shouldn’t be about growing our churches. Um it. It should really be about helping people find hope find freedom. Um, finding finding the fruits of the spirit peace love patience kindness gentlemen like finding what life can really experience and feel like life to the folio on John 1010 um, and this is how people find it. Um is you know they mature as disciples of Jesus and and do the same like we use this first. This is.
Andrew – Who.
Josh – The verse we read was was Matthew four 19 but come follow me and I’ll make you fishers a men like we use this first a lot in our church planning circles. Um, this is how we define a disciple. It’s someone that knows and follows Jesus being changed by Jesus in his own mission with Jesus.
Andrew – The.
Josh – Like when you live out these 3 areas you’re being a disciple of Jesus like if you’re if you’re following Jesus but you’re not being changed by Jesus or you’re not a mishu of Jesus we would argue. You’re not a disciple of Jesus yet not a disciple of Jesus in the sense like your salvation is is in question.
Andrew – Who.
Josh – But a disciple in the sense that like Jesus is control in leading your life and you’re going to become more and more like Jesus on the regular like there’s plenty of christians that I think they’re they’re salvation secure they show up. You know Sunday from time to time or you know on the weekend from time to time you know they give here and there I don’t think that’s a question.
Andrew – M.
Josh – You know their behavior can’t be a question about their salvation. You know they’re not necessarily fully connected. 1 is the result of the other but at the same time I think there’s people they’re salvation secure because they’ve recognized. They’re a sinner. They’ve recognized that Jesus their way to salvation and that Jesus is. Lord of their lives and yeah has forgiven their sin. That’s all you need, but you’re missing out on so much life when we choose not to be more and more like Jesus but that’s kind how we break it down. They know and follow Jesus. They’re being changed by Jesus and they’re on mission with Jesus. Um.
Andrew – You know.
Andrew – Yeah, and.
Josh – This kind of how we break this whole thing and we try to help people did like you said every aspect of their life with their family with their work with the other friends with their daily life. You know, um and like the other part of this too is it’s all relational right? like Jesus invited them into relationship with him so he could.
Andrew – That’s good. Yeah.
Andrew – Um, yeah.
Josh – Essentially do these things teach him how to follow change them but who he wants them to be and and get them on mission to help others do the same um like but it was all done inside a relationship for 3 years he prepared you know these guys to go out and essentially do the same thing that was done to them with others and I think we missed that.
Andrew – Um, yeah.
Andrew – And yeah, dude random question obviously I didn’t prepare you for this at all. But why do you think that Jesus went to fishermen like in this. Um.
Josh – Christianity has changed.
Andrew – This Matthew account. Ah Jesus was walking by the sea of galilee. He saw 2 brothers Simon who is called Peter and Andrew his brother. So then he says follow me I’ll make you fisher’s men then going from there. He saw 2 other brothers change the son James the son of zebede and John his brother. In the boat with zebadi their father mending the nets he called them and immediately they left their boat and their father followed him. Ah why fishermen like why? do you think he went to these guys not not specifically these guys but like it just strikes me as like the occupation like. He’s obviously speaking to them in a context they get when he’s talking fishing but like why do you think he went to literal fishermen and said these are going to be my first disciples I recruit I don’t know.
Josh – I think he was sitting with god since the creation of time talking through kind of this mission of let’s start the church and provide salvation to humanity and they came up with this line I’ll make you fishers of men. They really liked it and they’re like. Well, you know to Matthew the tax collector. That’s not gonna make any sense. Um, so let’s started to see a galilee. We’re only going to teach there for a while until we find the right guys to kind of I don’t I really don’t know.
Andrew – Ah, Matthew wouldn’t get it.
Andrew – Rate rate rate rate rate. Ah yeah, yeah.
Josh – And there was other disciples too like you know Matthew being one of them that were in other professions I would assume the majority of people during that day were fishermans. That’s how they made their fishermen. That’s how they made their living I would assume like especially around the sea of galilee like where Jesus spent most of his time but he could have started anywhere like.
Andrew – Um, fishing farming. Yeah.
Josh – I don’t know and we do know like from from John 17 like you know Jesus goes through the whole thing of like I’ve I’ve done what you’ve called me to do god I’ve invested in the people you’ve called me to invest and he even ends that. Little section there with you know god I I don’t pray for the whole world I pray for these these people that you’ve given me um, like it was intentional that it was these men I guess Judas could be you know questionable how that plays into that that that theology but um.
Andrew – Yes.
Josh – Then you know Paul come along after the fact I don’t know I don’t I don’t know exactly why it was fisherman. It’s good analogy. It’s still the same analogy. Um, and all yeah.
Andrew – Um, yeah, yeah, it’s 1 anybody can relate to because we still catch fish in the water. You know it’s not like that’s changed even though a lot has like yeah you still catch fish like that’s where it used to come from. Yeah.
Josh – Yeah I would assume yeah I would assume most people you say you know I think and most people know how fishing is done while they’ve ever done it. They have an idea of fishing like it’s one of the oldest professions out there outside of another one that we know how that’s done as well. But we won’t mention that on this podcast.
Andrew – Great moving.
Andrew – So.
Josh – Um I I think this this goes hand in hand Jesus says this later? Um, but he says the harvest is plentiful but the workers are few um like what does Jesus mean by that one.
Andrew – Who. Yeah, that’s another one that that people might say and I think what that means is so well. Okay, the real straightforward ways that like there is plenty of mission to do. There’s a lot of people who need to be aware. Of of the way of Jesus and who need to be disipled or discipled in this way like lots of people you know in your world. The harvest is plentiful like there’s a lot like that. The harvest is plentiful means like the grain there’s a lot of grain. We just need to cut it down and bring it inside. Um. In that same way. There’s a lot of people who need the lord. You know there’s a lot of people who could come and follow god but the workers are few like we don’t have where we’re short on labor like that’s the 1 thing we need more of is more. Not just people to go and cut down green but people to go preach people to go disciple people to live out an authentic Jesus life wherever they are and to influence their sphere of influence towards Christ like I think that’s what that means like the kingdom. There’s there’s no scarcity in the kingdom just because you come and follow Jesus doesn’t mean 1 less person can’t it’s not ah it’s not a set pie. It’s ah it’s ah it’s fractal. It’s like yeah as many people as possible. That’s who we want you know.
Josh – Do you.
Andrew – And it’s not for our church size number of of butts and seats or anything like that. It’s like yeah god’s kingdom doesn’t have limits in in how many people can be invited and in fact, it’s not ah, not a seeding compassion or capacity issue. It’s a. Labor capacity like we just need more people living out this jesus life authentically um, not this jesus life is in this the podcast our name but but a real Christ following life. You know that’s what I think that means um. What do you think? man.
Josh – No I think that’s great too and like here’s the craziest part like um I don’t know if the harvest levels have changed since when Jesus said this to the disciples and you continue to say this to the church but the fact is there’s still few workers out there.
Andrew – Movement.
Josh – Like there’s few people that are that are trying to live out the great commission as we’ve been commanded to do and you know I’ve spent a lot of time in church work like I was in ministry at at in 2004 so you know it’s been a couple of decades almost and um, even in the process of that like. You know when I first got into ministry it was a lot of talk about you’re 1 or the other right you were a discipleler or you were an evangelist. You weren’t both so like together we fulfill as the church and this is true. We do together fulfills the church but we said it in such a way that we separated the responsibilities inside of it. Like oh I’m ah I’m more of a discipleler than ah than an evangelist. So like I don’t have to actually evangelize and help people come to know Jesus or like I’m an evangelist I just get them saved and then it’s someone else’s problem. Um, and there’s plenty of verse we used to kind of like warp that like you know Paul says you know? ah.
Andrew – Right? right? no.
Andrew – Yeah.
Josh – I plan to see to Paulus Water but only god can make it grow which is a great representation of you know roles like we all have roles to play but at the same time like we’re accountable to the great commission and I think we like to forget parts of it because it’s harder for our personality than other parts of it. But. Yeah I think there’s a lot of fewer workers out there that want to actually live this out or or more than content with just going to services singing a few worship songs. So I feel good about myself and then going back to my day life and very rarely thinking or talking about Jesus with those they come in contact with and you know.
Andrew – M.
Andrew – Yeah.
Josh – I think that part’s probably gotten worse I think Jesus was speaking to this from a different from the same perspective but a different perspective like he was trying to introduce something new. He’s talking to 12 men and you know the other disciples that were around him that are about to launch this thing. Um, when he left so like there’s a different piece in that. But.
Andrew – Um, yeah.
Josh – You know we’re still talking to the jews as well of like you know you’re not following me. We’re not a relationship anymore and all those things are still true today unfortunately like church is ah is a I check the boxes I’ve attended I’ve given I’ve served I’m good. Um, and those are.
Andrew – Yeah.
Josh – Those are in portfoal and helpful things. But those aren’t what define you as a christian its relationship and I think all too often man do we forget that and we miss the I will make you part. Um, right? We’ve talked about this you know plenty of times in the last couple of seasons um of. You know we try to take control of the sanctification process or the process of Jesus Molding us and who hes call us to be um, rather than letting him lead that process and that should you know be an active participant in it. Um, so Jesus can change our hearts um to who he wants us to be. But yeah I don’t know it’s It’s sad and but I get it too like life is hard. Life is busy. We’re so focused on me me me these days that um, like we we forget about the others that we could be having an impact on but I also think the more you mature in your relationship with Jesus meaning.
Andrew – Yeah.
Josh – Becoming more and more like him loving god more loving people better. Um, like it is easier to live out the great commission. Um, you become a lot more attractive to people when you show that the the you know the fruits of the spirit these traits of walking with Jesus.
Andrew – Um, yeah.
Josh – Um, and it becomes easier to do these things and live on mission with Jesus and be changed by Jesus and following Jesus but you’ve got to do the hard work and be intentional building relationship with Jesus along the way that I think it’s it’s hard for us to do.
Andrew – Yeah, yeah, yeah, and it it just takes dedication. It’s not ah, it’s not a 1 click order type thing you know like I’m still like you and I maybe were’re old. We’re old. We established that at the beginning. So. Like I’m still impressed at things like oneclick order on Amazon where it’s just like boom done. Don’t have to think about that it’ll be here in a day and half or whatever you know.
Josh – Dude did you know Amazon sells scales that it gets below a certain level just automatically adds it to your cart that’s crazy.
Andrew – See beautiful dang that is crazy that is but like but we have so much convenience and automation and things like that in life that I think that’s maybe 1 of the things that almost makes it harder. To to live out this jesus life because it is slow most of the time it’s daily. It’s like making a lot of small choices of like yeah I’m still gonna stay faithful to this I’m still I’m gonna go through. What might feel like the motions and reading my bible are praying I’m going to sit quietly and try to listen to god even though I have a million things I could do you know where it’s it’s not one of the things that like god is totally capable of doing ah a lightning bolt type moment and doing something crazy.
Josh – Yeah.
Andrew – In the moment in my experience. That’s very very rare. You know and and if you come if you get that it probably comes on the heels of years of waiting you know, um or crazy circumstances. But yeah man like it’s slow and steady. It’s worth it.
Josh – Yeah, yeah.
Andrew – It makes it. It is more attractive. It’s It’s a better life like we’ve talked about it’s a good call. Um, but it’s It’s not a quick hit. It’s not a quick win. It’s ah it’s a lifetime. You know it’s like it’s a series of a thousand choices I guess.
Josh – Yeah, and it’s hard to right? Yeah like I think you know there’s a part of it. Yeah, you have to be naive in inside a christianche. We talked about this few weeks ago like. Having the faith of a child um not really understanding the full weight of what Jesus is leading you to but there there comes times throughout your your relationship with Jesus that like you know as he says like you’re dying to yourself. Um, like it’s less a emorages means like there’s a grieving process that happens of you know, maybe dreams that you had but they’re not dreams that god wants you to chase after or passions that you have to you know figure how to give up and. I’m not saying it’s going to be like a band-aid you know the pull bandid off kind of situation where god’s godt is loving needss carrying. He’ll walk you down those roads and give you the small victories to get to the big victory. Um, but like there’s definitely death of yourself in that and and that’s a hard man that’s a hard thing for people to do. Um so I get it. It’s hard.
Andrew – Yeah, yeah, me.
Josh – Like you want to follow Jesus you want to be changed by Jesus, you want to be a mission with Jesus but with all of those things like there’s moments that you have to make a choice. It’s like a fork in the road. Do I want to live the way jesus has called me to and continue down the the hard road at times which I think has much more. Abundance of life attached to it. Not just this life but the next um that we miss out on. Um, but I also understand those first few decisions or moments or death of something like that’s hard like man. that’s that’s painful ah sorry I quickly looked this up.
Andrew – You? Yeah yeah.
Josh – That’s funny I was gonna use when and Jesus tells Peter he says then I tell you Peter that on this rock I’ll build my church and the gates of hell won’t overcome it. Um that Jesus builds this church and we build disciples and let Jesus take care of the rest for us church leaders out there but in the same in these same verses later on. Matthew 16 Jesus said to his disciples that whoever wants um to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me whoever wants to save their life will lose it but whoever loses their life for me will find it. Whatever. What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world yet forfeit their soul or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul for the son of man is coming is going to come in his father’s glory with his angels and reward each person according to what they’ve done. Um, but like.
Andrew – Yeah, yeah.
Josh – Easy to read those verses even even to like have a ah ah like let’s all get on board with this idea but man when rubber meets the road. That’s a that’s a hard lesson to push through like that is when things get real.
Andrew – And yeah.
Andrew – Dude, it’s it’s yeah, it’s when things get messy and you have to choose like am I really going to give up something I wanted to do for me instead of you know following like am I really going to make this selfless choice or selfish one you know.
Josh – No.
Josh – Yeah, yeah.
Andrew – And I’ll tell you what man? kids and I know we got to go in a few minutes but kids give you opportunities to realize dying to self in a different way or at least gave me ones because things like sleeping in things like I’m just going to quick run to the store. It takes like.
Josh – Ah, yeah.
Andrew – 15 minutes just to get into the car. You know like makes tiny things ah arduous. You know and and it’s so easy to just be like now I’m just going to not do that or I’m just going to like pass off this responsibility to somebody else and do the thing I wanted to do anyway.
Josh – Yeah.
Josh – Yeah.
Andrew – Um, but but it puts you in your it puts it in your face and makes you realize like how many things you actually you know didn’t think about before that that you want to do the same way now. But but in that same way like man following Christ over time you get a lot of those choices of like. A lot of those moments of like man. Do I really want to like live this out today because it’d be nice. Not to die to myself today. It’d be nice. Not to worry about the other people’s needs in this moment and just think about what I want you know like that would be nice. Um, but that’s not the path.
Josh – Yeah.
Andrew – That that Jesus called us to walk you know and we’re not perfect at it I’m certainly not um, but but it’s a daily path. You know it’s like and it’s it’s new every every day new challenges and I don’t know it’s worth it. It’s like there’s life there.
Josh – Yeah.
Andrew – Um, there’s life in following Christ there’s life in in living this out authentically and um and there’s death to to indulging the things that that seem easier or better in the moment you know they don’t they don’t lead to the same places. They don’t lead in the same direction. So. They certainly don’t lead to to fishing for people that’s for sure. Maybe they do in ah in a bad man hunt style like you know the grocery store with the crazy net. Ah but not in the not in the way Jesus meant it. That’s for sure. Yeah.
Josh – Um, yeah, yeah.
Josh – Yeah, and I have found 2 like is I mature in my relationship with Jesus over the years like those decisions do get easier like you have those occasional like hard ones that you have to push through but like the decisions do get easier because Jesus have been proven faithful over and over again in your life. So like. When you choose those hard things of like I’m going to give up this for this or Jesus said hey I want you to focus in on this stuff rather than on this stuff. Um like those decisions do get easier because he’s proven like no, my way is the best for you. You want to live the full life that I promising you you know this is how you do it? Um, so.
Andrew – You you.
Josh – There’s other things that it like you’re stupid and passionate about you care a lot about him and you know it’s not where Jesus wants you to head and you have to give up that stuff or relationships that you have to you know, let play out that or you end up dying. Um those kinds of things I’m not saying all relationships. We should be very careful in what relationships are we allow to die. But um. Like just follow Jesus’ ‘ lead. Um I think it’s always helpful to you as we read verse like this like evaluate your your own heart like how well do you come to? Jesus meaning are you engaging in relationship Jesus you know how well are you following Jesus ‘ lead on things um how you know how well are you being changed like can you look at your life. Um, and use. You know we’ve we’ve said this before I use you know the fruits of the spirit as as a guide like am I more patient and I’m more kind do I have more joy do I have more self-control today than I did you know six months ago or a year ago um and if not then. Go back to the beginning because something’s out of whack either. You know you’re not pursuing Jesus or you’re not following Jesus’ ‘ lead. You know you’re trying to control that relationship. Um, and then you know you get through the list and you get to am I amishu with Jesus my trying to live out. The great commission is Jesus has asked me to do with the people that I’m in relationship with am i. Trying to foster relationship for that sake um to help others find this hope and this peace that that I have found um and if that’s not a piece then start working your way back. Well am I being changed by Jesus enough like what is what where does Jesus want to do a work in my own heart am I holding onto something that Jesus asked me to let go of. Um, that’s keeping me from being focused on the mission of the jesus you know there’s a progression to this and at the same time they’re all working you know, simultaneously as well. But I think they’re great tools. Ask Jesus Jo you know Josh and that was a weird freudian slip asked Jesus um.
Andrew – I yeah.
Andrew – And.
Josh – You know how? well am I following you god am I spending enough time with you god um, am am I on mission with you or am I running you know after my own dreams and my own missions about whatever I want for my life rather than what you want for my life. Um, but yeah, all great questions to be asking god for sure. Um. And yeah, you can be part of that. Harvest yeah, we we’ve all seen people’s lives change and maybe you haven’t experience this personally but like man when people make decisions for Jesus when people make whether it’s a salvation decision like they’ve come to Jesus or Lord and savior they recognize their sin asked for forgiveness or it’s a um. Ah, next step in the relationship with Jesus decision or and you played a part in that like whoo. There’s there’s no, there’s no greater high out there. That’s a fun day to hear that stuff and that’s how you live that full life right? It’s inside a relationship with people. Um, that’s where you get to find that adventure and.
Andrew – Um, yeah, it’s saying it’s insane. Yep Yep! true.
Josh – Be blown away by what Jesus can do in you and through you if you just choose to keep taking that right next step with Jesus on whatever that happens to be but come follow me and I will make you fishures of men Andrew last thoughts as we close this bad boy out I know you’ve got baby in hands.
Andrew – Ah, yeah I got ah I got a baby who has thoughts dude. It’s just worth it I mean I feel like I’ve I’ve said that a lot of times. Um, but yeah, be be part of this journey be 1 of the workers in the field be one of the.
Josh – Getting so big.
Andrew – Fishermen throw in the net like get in on it because because it is worth it. it’s it’s good it’s better for you. It’s better for those around you better for those you love? So thank you for being a part of this Josh. Thank you for this conversation. My friend love you dude.