Josh: Hello. We’re just two normal guys trying to live this jesus’ life. My name’s Josh.

Andrew: Hey. Hey. I’m Andrew and we are this Jesus life podcast. Andrew. We are on episode 13. That is the lot of taste on chickens. A lot of updates on shack. That’s a lot of talking, man. How do you feel about it? Episode 13.

Josh: We’re going to push this episode back on releasing to Friday. So it’s episode 13 on Friday. So it’s like, Ooh, but it’s still, but that’s okay. Next week the 13th. Oh no. Thursday. So 13th. Uh, nevermind. Doesn’t matter. It’s so good to see you. It’s so good that you’re hearing my voice and those listening as well.

We appreciate you listening.

Andrew: It’s good to be seen by you. It’s good to be heard by you. Thanks for listening. If you are listening, we appreciate it. It’s pretty cool. Um, that you’re checking this out and. I gotta be honest. The biggest update. Yeah, I have on chickens, Andrew, the most important thing I can share two things.

One. I still have 16, no more chickens died.

Josh: I was worried about that. That was be my question. It was two days every day

Andrew: and checking them every day. Like I walked out there and I immediately count and like one, two, three, four, five,

Josh: I think running around like super fast. So like it takes, it’s kind of a pain count them.

Andrew: They usually get like really enthusiastic and freaked out when I first walk out there and then I just stand there for a second. They just like, look at me or like start like.

Josh: You know, like do assuming like have like a whistle and then they line up for you so you can count them.

Andrew: Actually just walk out there and say, Hey ladies, and they’ll come run it out of

Josh: drain a chicken.

Andrew: I did not very well. There’s not much, you could train a chicken, but they know my voice. So they come out to that. So that’s cool.

Josh: Um, Oh, but they got a sweet 16 ladies that love your voice. That’s right. Cumbers.

Andrew: They love cucumber. That’s the update is I was telling you, Jan has been making, making pickles, like crazy, but we have a bunch of, yeah.

Josh: We’re hoping to, I don’t know, happened to get a ups package. You mail just randomly. Oh, dude, by the way, I didn’t tell you this beforehand. Sorry. I’m digging into my drawers if you’re just listening. Not those drawers, my desk drawers. Okay. You can’t see this if you’re listening, but Josh can see this on the screen.

Okay.

Andrew: I liked that.

Josh: That’s what’s out a bunch of credits leftover. On a sticker mule. So I’ve ordered a bunch of these that I need to send to you. So

Andrew: dude, those are awesome. That’ll go, that’ll go right on my Nalgene. And maybe on some of our lovely listeners stuff,

Josh: you never know you send us a message and we’ll, we’ll get your contact information.

Send you a nice sweet sticker. That’s right alone,

Andrew: dude. How are you? How’s your week going? How’s Jack. You doing well.

Josh: Dude, absolutely doing well. Cause hockey’s back on TV, uh, in full force, it’s like 9:00 AM to 10:00 PM every day, hockey nonstop, which means I don’t get a lot of work done of the day, which my boss knows.

I told them, Hey, I’ll just be honest with you over the next few weeks. Probably not going to get a lot of productivity out of me. He seemed fine with it. Uh, probably until my productivity actually goes down and then he’s going to have something to say about it, but, uh, yeah, it’s lots of hockey abs one last night with, or yesterday afternoon with 0.1 seconds left on the clock.

Uh, so that was pretty sick. Yeah. Type one or. I don’t remember what the score was. We were tied with 0.1 seconds left with the puck in the net. That’s embarrassing for awhile, but yeah, dude, is that nice? Not that it really matters right now. Like we’re in playoffs, we’re just kind of playing for position.

It’s still, but

Andrew: I mean, when you in, at the last, the final buzzer like that, it’s awesome. No matter what that’s what’s up.

Josh: Yeah. It was a lot of fun. But, yeah, Jack’s good. He’s still check, uh, caught him cuddling with the Teddy bear today. Uh, so that one on Instagram. Cause he’s just has to, uh, but yeah, other than that, things are great.

I can’t complain. There’s a little overcast today and cloudy, but a very nice

Andrew: that’s awesome.

Josh: So good. So we’re talking about, we’re talking about God. Yeah, we haven’t talked about them before. Well, what is God

Andrew: to you? Is the question, right? What is God

Josh: that’s really you.

Andrew: Yeah.

Josh: Well, and it’s this whole idea of, of what does our view of God and how that affects our relationship with God.

Like making sure we have a good view of God is going to have a massive impact on really us finding hope us experiencing freedom. Alex has experienced the John 10, 10 life life to the full, you know, the Jesus promised us is, has a lot to do with our view of God, but. Yeah, I didn’t mean to cut you off. I apologize.

Uh, our producer has informed us this week that I cut off Josh three times in our last podcast episode. And Josh only cut me off once and he apologized for it, which just shows the Josh’s just much more of a gentleman than I am. And I’d even notice.

Andrew: What were you saying? Sorry, I wasn’t listening.

No, it is all good. I was going to say, yeah, I was going to cause you, you kind of said, Hey, let’s talk about this. And I was like, that sounds like a great topic, but I was just curious to start, like, why why’d you want to talk about it? Like why’d you want to talk about the way people see God, like their view of God if I am tracking, right.

Why do you want to talk about this

Josh: topic? Yeah. Uh, I think it really does come down to like our views of God really do have a drastic impact of our relationship with God. And, you know, as we dig more into this, we’ll kind of hit certain, maybe the more popular views or false use of God and, and dig into those things.

But, uh, like if you think God is a vengeful, God. Like, that’s going to have an impact on you. Like you’re going to live a life with Jesus constantly, always looking over your shoulder and I’m just expecting, just waiting for him to, to catch you doing something wrong so we can pounce on you. Um, and that’s not necessarily who got his though.

He may be just, he’s not, um, a God that’s that’s out to get you. Um, that’s not as hard as we see throughout all of scripture, not just the new Testament.

Andrew: Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense. It’s like, it is huge. And I know some of the topics we’re going to cover are like judge, um, vending machine, theoretical safety, net, all of that.

And if you view God through one of those lenses and it’s only partially true or it’s, or it’s wrong altogether, then I guess the way you pray, the way you talk about it, the way you act, the times you turn to him or don’t. All of that’s different, right. Because of those views.

Josh: Oh, for sure. Yeah. Oh for sure.

Absolutely. Dude, are you rocking a paper Bible right now?

Andrew: I’m rocking a paper Bible. I have it out in front of me and I plan on, bring up. I was kind of flipping through and looking at different things that,

Josh: where are you doing the whole, like, do you do in the whole, like, uh, Like something through your fingers and just putting your finger down and like, this is we’re gonna talk about today.

No, no, I would need to do that really quick for us just to see it just,

Andrew: I was doing that only. I’ve like, I’ve highlighted a bunch of things of like circled stuff, you know, as you can see, meet

Josh: little dude, you pull her for this episode.

Andrew: No, I very hardly did. So I went through and I was looking at some different kind of ideas or different things that I’ve just like noted over time.

And gotcha. So one verse that, that I was planning to bring up is Micah. In Micah, it’s a pretty famous first, but Micah six verse eight. Um, and it says he has told you, Oh man, what is good? And what does the Lord require of you, but to do justice, to love kindness and walk humbly with your God. Um, I’ve always loved that verse because I worked for compassion and one of them t-shirts was, um, it says like, act justly, love mercy, mercy walk humbly.

And it’s all about that guy. So. But what does the Lord require of you, but to do justice, to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God. Now that might not be like the most complete picture of the whole Bible or the most perfect verse for this. But I think, um, some of those characteristics are really great when you think about, if I see God as just a friend, just to like my best friend.

Then

Josh: how

Andrew: does that inspire me to, to do justice? Um, I don’t know. I don’t know. Well, I just see God only his friend only is super relatable and he’s really kind only as love as a lot of people might. Say, uh, in today’s kind of USA, Christian world. Um, God is just love, you know, um, well, I don’t know what inspires justice out of that, um, to love kindness that that’s about friendship, that’s about relationship, um, to walk humbly with your God, to, to know that your God is big, you know, that’s that’s, I think important too is knowing that.

We’re small and God is greater than us. That’s like the fear of God that we read about a lot in the Bible. So I was just looking at that verse as you were talking. And, and that’s what I was thinking is like those three little attributes to have highlighted, uh, justice, kindness and walking humbly with God.

So I’m rocking the paper Bible tonight. And so we’ll see where that goes.

Josh: Do that. So that’s pretty exciting. I don’t know where my paper, paper Bible is. I’m between houses. So most of my stuff is in storage. Uh, so I’m seeing my paper Bible since all that went down. So I don’t, I don’t, I don’t know. Yeah. I don’t think I have actually have any paper Bibles with they’re all in storage.

That’s hilarious. Thank you, Lord Jesus. For the internet and technology. So the Bible anywhere I go, but yeah, I really don’t make her bubbles.

Andrew: Yeah, you would totally have it if you didn’t have a Bible on your phone. And if we’re being honest, like we’ve talked about in the past, I mainly listened to my Bible these days, but yeah.

I saw it right there and I’m like, let’s check that out. We’ll see where it leads. So, yeah. There’s your dose of Mike six.

Josh: Let’s do. Yeah. Well, let’s, let’s talk about like some of, kind of the faulty views of God and kind of where those may lead us in terms of like the really popular ones. Um, probably the fact that like, God is maybe God is vengeful is probably a better way to say it.

Then God is judge though. God is ultimate judge. It’s not necessarily. Characteristic in which he functions on a regular basis. Right? Mmm. Uh, God has vending machine. Maybe we need to unpack that idea is this whole idea that God, um, and maybe we don’t necessarily. Verbalize it this way, because we’re smart enough to know that would be wrong to say guys, a vending machine, but we function that way.

So like the only time I talk with God or talk with Jesus is when I need something. When I want something, when I want him to intervene in some way, or give me something that I want. And then that’s kinda where that vending machine idea comes from is, you know, we though we may not say oftentimes it’s how we treat God.

That definitely has a massive impact on our relationship with God. Like I’ve been doing a lot of reading in terms of, um, our relationship with God, but more in like our identity in God. And, um, Um, how do you really trust God? And then how does that translate rather than, um, trying to please God, or, um, trying to, um, just live by rules and do do’s and don’ts.

So I don’t fall into sin and piss Scott off, like that’s kind of this idea. Um, but in that, that whole thing is like, there’s a depth to our relationship with Jesus that so many of us miss out on, um, Yeah, I think we talked about this last week, or I don’t know. I think it was in the notes if we didn’t talk about it, but, um, you know, with a woman at the, well, when Jesus has that conversation and he says this, you know, I have what I’m going to give you this living water.

You’ll never thirst again. Like I think that’s real. I think, um, That people can never thirst again, that no matter how difficult life gets, uh, I think people can still function in great faith can still function in great hope, can still function knowing that God is faithful and he they’re going to live inside of that with a level of, um, uh, confidence that probably they.

They wouldn’t experience without it. Um, so it’s so kind of this topic came from that idea is like, yeah, part of our issue is we have bad views of God. Like I don’t spend time with God. I just ask God for things. Right. And that’s kind of our relationship and that’s the extent of our relationship and how much we miss out on that.

But,

Andrew: and I think on this, on the vending machine analogy, but. It’s like, it’s more than an analogy. It’s a, all of these things are like the paradigms through which you view God. So, um, yeah, you know, it’s like, I’m, I’m struggling to come up with great analogy, but basically when you, when you look at God as a vending machine, you’re kind of saying a few things about the, the thing you call God.

Um, you’re, you’re kind of saying like, I compartmentalize that because it’s only there for me, uh, when I need it or want it. Um, God is only there for my purposes. Um, and it’s at my will for when I decide to go, um, pray, ask for something. Get a pop, whatever you’re. And I say, pop, I know that’s weird, but get a soda, get a Coke, get a mountain, do whatever you’re doing.

Um, so God is like there for me, you know? Um, and it’s at my will. He’s kind of just in the corner, I’m in the vending machine and I think that’s pretty applicable because then it’s like, Almost like I control God, you know, like a vending machine. He doesn’t do anything except sit there, you

Josh: know, until you

Andrew: go up to it and make the choice to select before and put in a buck and you’re good to go.

Josh: Well. Yeah. And even to kind of. Push down this idea of vending machine. Like I have to put in something to get something out, right? So now it’s this cause and effect, relationship that so many Christians fall into that. Well, God’s not gonna bless me this way because I’m not living in this way. God says I’m going to bless the evil and the righteous, like I don’t.

Yeah. It doesn’t matter, your bet, your behavior doesn’t change what I do. Um, and that’s the piece that we get. So hung up on, like, I gotta put a dollar in. I gotta do. I gotta go to church. I gotta read my Bible. I gotta stop looking at porn. I got gotta whatever you put the categories in the right. Like I just got, got stopped gossiping or got some smoke in the weeds or sorry, the herb d’oeuvres podcast Amman.

Like, and then God will do all of these things for me or when God doesn’t do all these things for me. Conclusion was, Oh, I didn’t put enough money in the machine. That’s why God didn’t do it for me. Yeah. But yeah.

Andrew: Yeah. Sorry to

Josh: interrupt you. I apologize. No, no. Where my interrupt shop of your thought, you didn’t, you

Andrew: added to it in a great way.

Josh: Um,

Andrew: now the man in, there’ve been times in my life where I viewed God as a vending machine. Um,

Josh: no, I think everybody has

Andrew: like, I, and some of the most like forward and like, you know, just kind of silly as I look at it, or like there were moments in college when I had just not studied for a test or in high school where I’d just not worked in nearly the way I needed to.

And I just did that, like hail Mary that we’ve talked about of like, God, if you helped me ACE, this thing, I will do. Whatever for you where it’s like the reverse of like, um, vending machine. If you just give me this Coke right now, um, I’m going to like do something. I’m going to put it in a $5 bill tomorrow, you know, like, I know it’s only buck, but go fiver on it.

Josh: Um,

Andrew: but that’s not the how it works. Like it doesn’t work that way. Even in this view, you can have of God where sometimes you’re like, Do all of this for me. And then, then I’m going to, I’m going to hook you up with my life, God.

Josh: Um,

Andrew: and it’s like the silly game we play, because there’s just no relationship in that.

You know, at the end of the day, there’s no trust. There’s no care. It’s just like, Oh my God just does what I want him to when I want him to. And he never chooses to interfere in my life if I don’t make him interfere in my life, you know?

Josh: Yeah. And I think that, I think that’s where we fail as Christians is.

We don’t like, we talk about relationship constantly because it’s the thing that deaf, deaf differentiates us between the Catholic church. Right. That’s what Protestants talk about it so much. But, um, in all reality, like we don’t teach it well, like though we talk about God is a relational God that God sent Jesus to the cross to die for your sins to restore that relationship.

Um, we don’t talk about. We don’t teach people well, in terms of how do you genuinely have a relationship with God? Like how do I genuinely approach and have conversation and open up and be authentic and vulnerable and have those difficult conversations and have those great conversations and have those simple conversations.

And those conversations seem not to matter, but in relationship always matters. Right? I just don’t think we do a good job. And that’s, I think that’s why a lot of people end up in this vending machine idea or this theoretical idea. That God is kind of in the cosmos around. And sometimes he intervenes and sometimes he does.

Um, but he’s kind of this idea rather than this person. And, you know, we serve a, uh, an actual person. He’s a. Not created human being, but like he’s, he’s, he’s he does have existence. Like he has a thing, um, that we get to commune with and have conversations with.

Andrew: Well, it’s kind of nice to say it’s like not nice to say.

I can understand the draw of being like, God is just theoretical, you know? Um, I can understand that like, God is just like the waves. Did it, it feels like you don’t have to commit much to me. I like that. That’s just like the wind. Um, I can’t make it Wendy and I can’t stop it from being windy, but I know it’s going to come and it’s going to go whenever it wants to, you know, it’s like this a theory will thing.

That’s just like this force you can’t do much about. And sometimes it’s like this really calm, like I’m sitting by the pool or by the beach and getting some nice breeze. And it’s great. Other times it’s a hurricane hurricane and other times you’re like, I just wish we had some wind cause it’s so stinking hot or cold or whatever, but yeah, it’s just far away in theoretical and it’s like, I know there’s a God, but I could never know who God is or what God’s like or anything like that.

You know, you just put it in this box of like, Well, yeah, it’d be silly to think you could. No, you know, of course I don’t have to change my life to follow one God, because God’s like unknowable and far away, you know, it’s like the breeze. So that’s what I mean, like I understand the draw to that of like, you just couldn’t know, you know, you can’t know who God is, but of course there is a God, cause look at all this stuff, you know, um, Yeah.

So I get the draw to that

Josh: big time. Yeah. No, and there’s definitely safety in the distance idea or the fee, the theorial idea of, of God. And, um, then you also don’t have to like, um, Define God, right? Like you can kind of live in this world of like, well, there’s not many gods, but there kinda is many gods and I don’t have to land on one God.

Um, and I can kind of live in this, this, uh, wishy washy, uh, kind of theology because I don’t. I don’t want to commit to anything and be wrong. I think there’s a lot of different avenues of, of why we ended up down those roads or, you know, a lot of people end up down those roads because they want God to show up kind of going back to the vending machine idea.

They wanted the God to show up in a certain way. And they thought they put all the right. They put the, it was a dollar 72 and they put those two extra cents in there. And that, in that, those two, yeah, those two dimes, uh, and God didn’t show up. So will they, God must be distant. Like I’ve had those thoughts plenty of time in my life of like, God you’re intervening in the way that I thought you would in this situation or where you’re not, you know, working this out.

How I, how I hoped she would. So maybe, but I’m doing all the right things. God. So this is one. Yeah, you, maybe you aren’t actively involved in our lives. Maybe you aren’t actively involved in, in humanity. You created us and you’ve kind of let us just kind of live this thing out and eventually you’ll come back, but, um, Yeah, maybe, maybe that’s kind of that fuel tube, but I get it.

Um,

Andrew: so one other one other thing, so I can understand somebody who would say, um, God is truth. Like God is just truth, all the truth in the world, all the things that are true, that that’s. Points to God care, God’s character, you know, like I’ve, I’ve heard that type of thing of God is just truth. And you can find truth in all these religions, all these philosophies, all of this stuff.

And that points back to God. And I think there’s some aspect to that that is right in that all things that are true are of God, I think. Um, but the thing that’s maybe not. Right in there. The thing that makes it fall really short is that God is a being, you know, like God is a, a singular. B and, and God, there is a God, there are many, many small G gods that you can follow, but yeah, there’s one God, um, that is, is overall things that is overall truth.

That is over all time, all space. There’s one singular God. Um, there’s just a lot of impersonators. Um, so I just. I can totally understand this theoretical idea because if you’re like, God has just truth. And then you’re like, but I found some awesome truth in my yoga class last week I found, yeah, a bunch of truth in poetry.

I went to a. Uh, Ramadan service or whatever that’s called, you know, like NFN some real truth there. Um, I was just watching CNN and saw some real truth. I was, you know,

Josh: no,

Andrew: but what I’m saying is if you have this like loose version of, of what is God, um, and you just say, God is truth, then, then maybe

Josh: you can just.

Andrew: Everything becomes relative. It’s like all religions are equal. All things are equal. All gods are equal because there are no available. Do you know? It’s theoretical. And I don’t think that’s the case, but I, I do understand why people go there, you know, or stay there.

Josh: Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Well, and the problem and kind of why we, we.

Decided to tackle the topic was like, when we take those positions, we miss out on so much, like when God is relative or God is Mmm, Mmm. Just a theory or an idea, or maybe a belief system. Like we, we lose out on so much depth of relationship and, and I think that’s the biggest difference in, in our faith as followers and Christians and followers of Jesus and Christians is we, we so.

Deeply understand that God is a personal God that not personal in the sense that he’s mine. I got to put him in this little box and he’s like my special, and I just get to rub him and hold onto him. And he, so, but he’s, he’s personal in the sense that he’s, he’s relationally. It’s like he’s sitting in front of me and we can have true conversations like you and I are having conversations right now.

Like, like that’s the type of relationship that God desires. But when we limit. Our view of God. And he’s just this idea of this theory, this distant God we miss out on so much depth of relationship. And I think oftentimes that’s the thing that drastically affects our faith in terms of like life’s going to get hard.

And when we talk about a full life with Jesus, this exciting, um, never, never thought that God would do intervene, use you in those ways. Like. We’re not saying that life’s going to be easy and awesome. Like we’re not prosperity in that perspective, but we are saying that even when life is difficult, even when life is seems almost impossibly hard.

Um, and oftentimes it is, um, even in those moments, My God is still my God. And he’s still right here with me. Like there’s comfort in that. There’s, there’s depth in that, that, that I know he’s got me, even though the situation around me is difficult. I get to lean on him for, for this living water. I get to lean on him for our relationship.

I get to lean on him for strength and for greater faith. And to, to believe that God is faithful, I’m in a holding on to those things. And we just miss out on so much. We miss out on so much with all these faulty views, but yeah, when we kind of dig into a theoretical idea, That’s that’s really what we’re missing out on is you’re missing relationship.

Like you’re missing out on so much, like sure. God is absolute truth. That that is true. Um, but that isn’t all God is. And I think, I think in, in human minds and kind of how we just try to process God is so vast and who he is. Um, and there are so many, like, there are so many, um, Nooks and crannies that you can dig into of who God is and understand his personality and understand his character in those ways.

Um, it’s so difficult for us as humans to do that, that we just, we start putting labels on things really fast and just so putting him in a box cause it helps us understand what God is. Absolutely truth. Yeah, he is. But he’s also love like he, he’s also a faithful. He’s also Holy at the same time songs is all powerful.

Like yeah. All these things that we can kind of dig into of who God actually is. To make up who God actually is. And we miss out on those things when we kind of limit God into such small little, um, buckets or terminology, but yeah. Um, how often Josh, have you prayed this prayer? Uh, God, uh, as we started out on this mission trip, or we started on this camp or we start out on this road trip, uh, I need you to protect us and save us from anything that may harm us.

And how often God just becomes this idea of safety net or body guard, right?

Andrew: Yeah. That’s a good point, man. I. I prayed that type of prayer many, many times. And it wasn’t, it wasn’t until like maybe, I don’t know, five, six years ago, seven years ago. Maybe it wasn’t that far into being married to Jana where, um, I was praying that on one of our long drives, you know, as we were about to pull out of the, uh, house or where we’re getting on the road and she challenged my thinking, like.

Why, why do you think you need to pray for your physical safety on this trip? Like if God wants you to be safe, he’ll keep you safe. If God wants you. If this is the last thing you’re going to do, it’s the last thing you’re going to do. I was like,

Josh: Whoa. Um, so.

Andrew: I don’t know. So I think one of the big things, things I pray about now, and I do want to hear what you’re going to say, but one of the big things I pray about now is that like, if we’re about to go on a drive, I asked that, um, that our conversation in our time together would honor God.

Um, with, instead of God, would you protect us physically? Would you give us alertness for the road? All of that. It’s like, God, let our time together today. Honor you. Um, not just our words or actions, but our thoughts. Let them be God honoring, um, and bless this time instead of. I’m letting it just be a boring five hour drive, you know?

So, yeah. But what were you going to say as I jumped in?

Josh: Um, I don’t remember now, but, um, I think there’s a piece too. Kind of, I think this is what really gets down to is there’s a version of Christianity, um, that has kind of been around in American society and I’ll just speak to American society. Cause I don’t know any other society, uh, for a long time in terms of God exists just to keep me safe, God exists, uh, uh, to keep me Holy and God exists to, um, I don’t know what else we can put some other blink in there, but nothing’s coming to mind.

Um, and this idea that like, Oh, God is there to keep me moral. Right? Like we talked about cursing a few episodes back, right? Like, well, you know, the, the moral right thing to do is to not curse well, sure. The more right thing to do in society may be that, but is that really what Jesus is asking us? Does he really care?

And we answered that in that episode, but I’m like, we’re getting to this idea that, um, like God just wants to be safe all the time and no, God. I don’t know if you’ve read scripture at all, but God’s not safe. There’s there’s no definition in scripture that, Oh, God is a safe gut. No, he’s not right. Like, he’s going to call you to do things that are going to stretch you.

He’s going to call you into situations that you feel like you’re completely overwhelmed unsuited for and outgunned for. Um, but yet. That was where the moments where God shows up in full, um, glory and full victory and intervenes. Um, but like we can’t get to those moments if God is just trying to keep everything safe and everything proper and everything, right.

Like we miss out on so much. Adventure that, that Jesus has kind of put before us that we could be experiencing and having, because we’ve put God in this idea of, well, he’s just my body guard. He’s just there to protect me. And because of that, the idea that like praying before those trips, that’s not bad.

Like. It’s not bad to pray for those things, but also want God’s will to happen in those moments. And we can pray for those things as well. But if we’re in relationship with God going into those situations, those prayers look drastically different at that point, right? Like I’m not praying God saved me.

And this was the line us. This is the first time I prayed and like, Two weeks. And I’m just praying for this because like, this is the right thing to do and God wants me safe. Um, but when we were in deep relationship with Jesus and we’re having conversations daily with Jesus, um, on a variety of different topics, not just my safety, um, that prayer looks drastically different.

Like, as I go into this, it’s God, like, is there anything that I should be watching, you know, mindful of? Is there anything I should be paying attention to? Like I have other people in the car and I’m responsible for them. God, should I be watching out for something important? Um, that may be passing by and.

Like you said, God, be in the midst of this conversation. Like, you know, if you have kids, like you have their undivided attention, well, they have headphones in it and iPhones, but you got a chance. Attention, you got a chance. I’m like, God, what do I say in this moment, that fruitful conversations, like those are the kinds of questions you’re going to start asking and conversations you guys are having with God that it’s not just about.

God saved me, protect me, keep me in this. You know, a bubble, some always, you know, never going to be harmed. Like Jesus never promised us rock and be harmed. You’re going to be harmed. We live in a broken, fallen world. Bad things happen to you. You cause bad things to happen. I’m like you’re going to be harmed.

It’s going to happen. But the reality is, is how we prove. But we live in that world. If like what God just has to save me. He’s my body guard. Well, what happens when he doesn’t? Hmm. So now what do you do in that moment? Yeah. Like, God, we prayed for safety, but yet both of our tires blew out. We flipped the car.

Where were you in that mode? Right. And you’re like, what? Like, that’s not the, like you missed out on so much, like, right. Like, God, wasn’t there with you in that moment though. Something bad happened. I think God’s still present. God’s still in the midst. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and that’s, that’s the,

Andrew: that’s the danger of, of having the, uh, the view that’s only partially, right?

Right. Like the vending machine, God, the, the theoretical or, or this one, the, the kind of body guard safety net, like whenever something happens that just violates the core way, you look at God, the core paradigm you see him through. Um, then you’re like, You have a couple of responses. One is just like confusion maybe of like, I guess I was just wrong, which maybe that’s the best response to have, because you’re at least open to like, maybe I didn’t have the full picture.

Um, and, or, and that’s

Josh: probably good. It’s like one or two things, right? Yeah. Like when things don’t happen, the way that we think they’re going to happen, we either blame ourselves or we blame gut, right? Yeah. I didn’t do enough. I wasn’t a good. That wasn’t a good enough Christian. I was whatever, whatever, or this sin, you know, I committed yesterday or this morning, whatever happens to be like, like, this is the reason that God’s right.

Harming me right now. He’s punishing me to teach me a lesson. You’re like, good. Does God discipline? 100%. Does he discipline by harming you? I highly. Highly doubt it. I’m sorry. Um, this isn’t, this isn’t the old covenant. We don’t function under the same rules. Um, our actions don’t have a huge effect on God’s blessing and God’s cursing.

Um, God’s going to bless and curse both evil and great. Um,

Andrew: but the other response, so that other response, sorry I interrupted you there. That was totally me. Um,

Josh: I haven’t talked to you before that, so

Andrew: yeah. Yeah. Fair fair. But the others

Josh: I’m gonna interrupt you again just for a second. I just love that our producer reached out to you to let you know this is what happened.

Did he say any damn thing to me? I didn’t hear from him this week. Uh, can you just try to cause problems? I want you to know mr. Purchaser. Uh, yeah. And leave this in the episode. Don’t you dare cut this. Uh, were you about unity? Okay. That’s that’s why we exist. That Jesus said that we will be known for how we love one another and it will be known by our unity.

You’re causing division, like sending these side messages in these secret little text messages and just kidding. We love you. We thank you greatly for, for editing our podcast, getting us up and running.

Andrew: Yeah. Stuart McKee, everybody

Josh: know where you were with all.

Andrew: Don’t worry. I’m going to take it right back there.

But Stuart McKee is helping us with this podcast and he’s killing it. So if you need somebody with all these

Josh: stuff reached out to

Andrew: him. Yeah. Or us,

Josh: you can reach out to them, reach out to us, we’ll tell and reach out to him. But, uh, he’s uh, he’s phenomenal what

Andrew: he does

Josh: totally phenomenal at what he does.

Sorry.

Andrew: Yeah.

Josh: So do you just gonna let you

Andrew: go, the other thing, the other response of when like your, your total paradigm of God is violated, like the safety net analogy where you prayed, keep us safe and your car flipped. Um, the other response, I think, is that. That like Satan, our enemy, um, loves those type of views where it’s like, you have this fragile view of God and I have the chance to shatter a

Josh: good word God’s view.

Andrew: Yeah. Thanks, man. I just, just thinking of like a lamp, you know, like you have a fragile view of God and, and, and I have the chance to break it. Um, and when it’s broken, I think this goes back to that kind of scripture. We referenced in the last podcast, like you’re kind of like the seeds that were thrown, um, that started to grow and grew up quickly, but they got choked out by the thorns and thistles, the worries of this life, the things that.

You know, came up quicker. You were growing up strong, you were starting, but then all the weeds choked you out. You know, you were too fragile. Uh, your view is fragile. It was brittle and it got broken and crushed, right? And those are the things that, that the enemy loves. He loves to keep us thinking. God is only, there is your body guard.

God is only there. As your vending machine, God is only there’s your cash machine, your cash register. God is only a judge. You know, like we didn’t, we kind of skimmed over that one, but, but when you believe God is only a judge, then really quickly, you can be like, well, if I’m going to be like my God. Then I’m just going to be the judge.

I have all these 2000 pages here, this Bible that tell me exactly how to live in the things that make God happy and the things that make God sad. So if I’m going to serve this God, then I better look like a judge. And I better make sure that everybody who’s doing anything wrong knows they’re doing it wrong because God’s a judge.

So if I’m going to be like

Josh: him, that’s good.

Andrew: I’m going to judge everybody, you know, and then state and comes in.

Josh: Boom

Andrew: wrecked. Ya. Like you were never, the judge you’d never had that authority. And by the way, I’m a lot smarter than you, you know? So it’s like things get wrecked easily when you only have a bat add a small view of it.

So,

Josh: yeah. Yeah, well, that’s the fairest season in Jesus’s day. Like here’s individuals that kept not only their commands, the commands that they created on top of those commands, um, to, to live Holy and to look perfect, uh, exteriorly, but in reality, like, uh, they’re missing out on so much of, of. Of this jesus’ life or at that time God, the father’s life that they could have had in, you know, they put unnecessarily burdens on, on those, around them that they didn’t have to because they were they’re acting as judge.

I’m going to imitate my God and my God is a judge. So I get to judge those around us and how easy it is to find herself in those places. Right. Like our pride starts to slip in and you’re doing really good. And you’re like, man, like, Not dealing with that soon anymore, and I’m not dealing with this anymore.

I’ve been so much better than this place. And then all of a sudden you see sin and your reaction to sin is. Well, while he can’t do that, that’s wrong. That’s sinful. I’m going to do something about, I’m going to fix this and you’re like, sure it is wrong. It’s sin, but is it your job to fix this as like our posture changes?

Right. Because the other posture, the, what I would argue is the godly posture is I see that man sinning and my response is, man, I could so easily be in that boat. I so easily could be doing the same exact thing that he’s doing. Because I’ve been there before and it’s out of compassion and care that I’m now trying to love this individual and not condemn, you know, condemning them and calling them a center.

Right. There’s a difference in that, in that posture, but that’s good if we take these, these inappropriate views of God, um, our, our faith becomes fragile. We become fragile and we’re just prime picking for the enemy.

Andrew: Yeah, thanks, man. Um, and I, one of the things, you know, like that, I didn’t plan that out. I think, I think there’s there’s moments which the Holy spirit just speaks through.

You or speaks through me or both in this stuff. So I didn’t ever, I’ve never said a fragile view of God in my life, but I’m going to remember that. Cause I’m like, that’s,

Josh: I’m going to steal it. You should,

Andrew: you should steal it. I give you full permission, but, so,

Josh: okay. So I’ll be honest with you, Josh, even if you did and that’s still steal it, it’s just, it’s a preacher’s work.

It’s kids steal ideas all the time. That’s fair.

Andrew: That’s totally fair. So man, we, so we can keep going on these, but I want to kind of shift for a minute of like, okay. So fragile views of God that we just talked about. How do we have. How do you have more whole views? And how do you know maybe if you’re like, how do you know if you’re in a view that’s just one sided, you know, how

Josh: do you know if you’re

Andrew: only looking at there’s this analogy of, of like five blind men are in a room with an animal.

An animal and they’re each describing one part of it. They’re like this, this thing is like, it’s a, it’s a foot. I can feel a foot. And the other, one’s like, no, it’s a tail like this thing’s all tail. Like, clearly it’s moving to tail and other ones, like now it’s this huge, like, Trunk, you know, that’s all it is.

It’s a big trunk. It’s a big nose. I can smell a here, sniffing. I can feel it. And then the reality is like, it’s an elephant, you know, they’re all seeing different, they’re all feeling different parts of it. Cause they can’t see the bigger picture of it being one elephant the entire time. There’s 10 different places in the room.

So, so how do you know if you’re just having that? Like. Myopic view of God, like seeing only his justice or only his love or only God, his protector, or, you know, like how do you identify that? And then maybe how do you work towards the start of a, of a more full view, um, on this side of heaven?

Josh: Yeah, I think, um, I think your conversations with God.

In what you talk about, how often you talk about things, the depth of those conversations in terms of what you dig into, the questions that you’re asking. I think those are all healthy signs of U of a. Of what your view of God is. Yeah. So if, if my view of God is he’s judged and he’s, he’s vengeful, he’s just kind of waiting for someone to screw up.

Well, my prayers are going to be a lot of God, forgive me for this. And God intervene in Sally’s life. Like she was looking at that man in the wrong way. You heard what she said? Sal

Andrew: sassy,

Josh: Sally freaking sass, sass. You Sally, if you’ve been listening to in a while, that that makes sense. If you haven’t that’s okay.

I don’t go back to those episodes. Do it. That goes to stay here. Yes. Skip the first couple. But. Like there’s, there’s a piece to that, right? Like if, if God’s just a vending machine while your prayer life is always about what asking God for things, God, I need you to do this, this, this, and this. God, I need you.

You do that, that, that, and that, right? Like if God’s a safety net, well, that’s going to show like what you’re praying about and what you’re taught and how often you’re doing it. Like, if God’s not personal to you, you’re not going to spend time with God as often, because he’s. Theoretically, he’s distant.

He’s whatever. I’m like my prayer life today is deeper and greater than my prayer life has ever been. And my entire life. And I don’t say this to say, Ooh, look at Andrew. I say that to say, when you correct the wrong views of God in your life, you start to find the right use of God in your life and start to live and lean into those things.

There’s a. There’s a depth in conversation that starts to get created. There’s a depth in relationship that starts to get created that maybe you didn’t have before. Like, we didn’t talk about anything that I haven’t had that view of God before. Like I’ve treated God like a bodyguard. I treated God theoretical and distant.

Especially when you come out of shitty seasons, I’ve treated God like. A judge in a vending machine that all God cares about is my sin and avoiding my sin. And in combating my sin, does God care about me combating my sin 100%? Is that all they cared about? Absolutely not. God cares about me as a human being that cares that I develop not just in conquering sins of my life, but, but in, in.

Loving people better in an understanding who God has created to me better to understand the visions and the dreams that he’s putting me to chase after those things. Right? Like there’s so many aspects of, of what God wants or life it’s not just single, you know, fights and fights and fights in. Yeah. You miss out on so much and I’ll argue if you don’t get into the depths of who God is, you don’t get into the depths of relationship with God.

You’ll never conquer the sins anyways. So just like give up just, you know, Enjoy them, like until you get to those places, like that’s all that’s going to get caught. Right. It’s really that moment of Andrew should enjoy yourself. See what happens when you take a small view of something you miss out on some of the trader depth.

Uh, but yeah, like. I think so. I think those are the signs to go back to answering your question. Like how, how often are you talking with God? What does that prayer feel like? What does it look like? And what are the types of questions you’re asking? I think those are all great signs to show you like, Oh wait, I might, I might think God’s angry.

Cause that’s how my prayers kind of leaning towards. Right, right. God forgive me for that. Well, yeah, God like prayer to free forgiveness and confessions probably feels a lot different today than it did five years ago. Like it’s it’s conversation and yeah, there’s remorse and there’s, there’s there’s to some extent, pain there, but it’s not in a sense of like, God, I need you to forgive me in this moment.

Let me go through all these things. It’s it’s. Gotta put these things in front of you and, and, and I’ve, I’ve harmed what we could have in that relationship. And yeah, like there’s a difference too at all. Um, that I think is important, but

Andrew: yeah. Yeah. That’s good, man. That’s really good, good perspective. And that’s like pretty practical.

Think about even jot down notes on the, the ways you commonly pray or the themes of what you pray, as you were saying that I was thinking about

Josh: like how often you pray.

Andrew: Yeah. Or how often you pray? Like when I pray it’s, it’s not always the same, but, but there are, there are elements where I know God is ultimately my judge, and I know that.

That what Jesus did on the cross broke the yoke of sin. That is up on me. Um, I still sin, I still fall short of a perfect relationship with God, but I know that I don’t have to live if only in sin because of what Jesus did. And I know that. I can honor God with my actions, with my thoughts, all of that. And I can look more like Jesus over time.

I can follow him better over time, but there’s times when I mess up, um, I was telling about telling you about one, uh, before we even clicked record just from a few days ago, um, times of, of God kind of speaking to me about behavior in my life that needs to change, you know, and it’s like, you revealed it to me and it’s, and I recognize.

You’re my judge, you are my God, there was sin and what I was doing. Um, but you’re going to help me change, you know? So there’s the confession side of like, here’s the stuff I was doing. Here’s the ways this happened. And then there’s the, the hope side of like, I’m confessing this, but I know that you revealed it to me because it’s not out of your power to change in my life, you know?

So there’s, there’s like

Josh: how is judged,

Andrew: but also an inhibitor or provider of change, I guess.

Josh: Yeah. Yeah. But like how exciting is it that you’re in a season? Cause this isn’t the first time that’s happened recently, but you’re in a season where God’s revealing things to you about your. I don’t know, lack of a better term behavior or blind spots.

It’s probably a bread. I wouldn’t say it. Right. Like blind spots that you’ve missed. Yes. Like that’s a fruitful season. Like you’re going to be a better follower of Jesus. More, more devoted follower of Jesus have greater faith in God, all powerful than you’ve ever had before, because God is. Essentially right now, pruning the heart.

Like those are exciting seasons, right? Like I’m in a season where I’m truly trying to understand and know how to love people. Well, I love people sacrificially. I’ve been in this season for like, I don’t know, six months. Yeah. But I had this, I had this like a pice of money.

We have to do like those tongue exercises or whatever to get our,

Andrew: yeah. You had an

Josh: epiphany. I don’t think those are them. I just have an idea that that’s not it. I think they’re different, but I had an epiphany, not that long ago where, um, I was interacting with someone that usually drove me nuts and I had compassion in the moment and I was like, wow, that’s weird.

Uh, have felt that before for that person, uh, just shows that the sin of, of, of my personality. But, uh, in that moment, you’re like, man, like I didn’t really, I wouldn’t have caught that six months ago or I wouldn’t have caught that a year ago. And here, Jesus, you’ve been doing this work in me as you’ve been pruning and shaping and changing, and we’ve been having conversations and I’m like, Like, wow.

Look where I look where I am today. Like, look what you’re doing anyway. So like I say all that, to say this to you, a word of encouragement of like, like you’re in an exciting time, like God is doing some cool things in your heart and in your life that are going to bring. They’re going to bring real fruit, not just to your life, but to the life of those around you and deepen relationship between people around you.

And you know, the fact that you’re giving up Coke, like that’s a huge deal. Like who, who thought you’d give up the cocaine? Yes.

Andrew: For the reminder,

Josh: for the record here, it was a few months ago and that was a big deal. Like now you’re on to giving up Coke. That’s exciting.

Andrew: No, that’s a for the record, I did not give up Coke because I’ve never used it in my life.

Josh: Still do it. Yeah. For the record. That was my passive. Yeah. That was my passive aggressive way. Yeah. Try to

Andrew: beat me up and

Josh: get me there. No, that’s the other part, like. Say Jesus kind of shared with you, the things he shared with you over this last weekend, two years ago. Would you have caught him then? No.

Who knows? Like, like there’s, there’s moments that like Jesus either pretty smart guy, as he knows the seasons that we’re in, he knows how to get really good to our hearts. His ultimate goal is yeah. To shape us and form us into the people he’s called us to be. But he also understands that that’s a journey and the things that I can understand today, maybe I couldn’t understand.

And I think this is what Paul talks about when he talks about the mysteries of the gospel and the mysteries of Christ. These are those mysteries. Hmm. Um, it’s this, this timing thing of like how God works and interweaves in our lives to shape us to who we’re called to be. And, um, like look lucky, you know, we’ll keep using these example.

Cause you’re like, like, look at these lessons you’re learning now. Yeah, you could be stuck in these places and these are lessons. God wants you to learn. He knows you can learn them and you’re choosing not to engage them. Or you just don’t have a deep enough relationship with Jesus in terms of like, you’re not communicating enough to hear Jesus say these things.

Um, you’re just looking for those like big God moments where he’s like, huh. And he’s like speaking audibly to you all of a sudden, right? Um, but that’s oftentimes not how Jesus speaks and it’s in those small whispers that, that Jesus does the work, but we don’t get to the small whisper until we’re in relationship and relatively deep relationships.

So we know what his voice sounds like. Uh, Well to, to be able to hear these things.

Andrew: That’s, that’s legitimately encouraging to me to hear, because I feel like I’m in a season of pruning, you know, and I say pruning because like literally one of the tasks on my, on my plate today that it didn’t get to, was to go into the garden.

And on the Brussels sprouts, we have like these huge ones grow it in these huge stalks growing. They grow in like poles and there’s like 40 breathable sprouts on each one. But

Josh: the Brussels sprouts is so much better gardening and chickens from you,

Andrew: but the Brussels sprouts won’t grow. Unless you clip off all the branches that grow off the stock, um, you have to let the branches grow until the brussel sprouts start to, and then you got to clip them all back except the very top ones.

So the sunlight can still have an effect on them, but. Um, so these branches are getting really like pronounced really big, really strong, but that, that plant will never do what it was intended to do, which is make Brussels sprouts. Unless I literally go and clip off, like, I don’t know, 30% of it, then it’ll produce the Brussels sprouts that have the seed in them that could spread that plant later, you know?

Um, and right now, yeah, I’m in a season in life, man, where I feel like. God’s revealing stuff to me about my own life, about my heart, by my behavior, that I’m having very clear choices on what do I, how do I act? You know, do I react positively or negatively to that? And I was trying to say like, if I just saw God as judge, then I would, I would hear that maybe adhered God reveal those things to me.

And then I would just go. Well, there’s nothing I can do about it. I’m dead in the water. Like maybe I should just stop trying to follow God altogether. Cause I’m just, I’ve been judged. I’m done. Like I came up short.

Josh: I’m a crappy Christian.

Andrew: Yeah. I’m a bad Christian. Um, but, but the reality is I see the, I hear that those things, I hear God speaking to me and, and it always comes with the hope side of like, I’m telling you this because there’s, you were on that path.

That’s not the path. That’s not the only path. Like I’m here to help you find the other path, you know? So God’s, I know God isn’t just judged in my life, but I know he is judged in my life. Like I know that’s a role, God plays. Um, the other thing I know, God’s not just friend in my life, like he’s not, not just a friend.

He’s not just there to be a, um, somebody to laugh with and a shoulder to cry on. Not, not just that. Yeah. But God is that like, that’s a, that’s a part of the, the relate-ability of, of Jesus. Like Jesus came as a person, so we could actually relate to God and understand God. Um, and not just see God as like this, this wind, you know, back to the, well, we talked about earlier, if this force that just acts that you can’t control, uh, uh, or, or understand or predict or any of that, um, So, no, no.

I see him as a lot of things. And then when I, when I think about the way I pray, um, man, when I pray about God being bodyguard in my life, it’s just because I understand that my safety is out of my control. Like there are things I could do. Like I could jump off a cliff and then it, then I know, okay, this was my choice, you know?

Um, but there, there are other things in my life where I’m like, There’s so much I can’t control. And then when I think about my family’s safety, like my daughter, my wife, all of that, there’s like, there’s so much, I can’t control. That I got to trust that God has that under control. And there’s times I asked that he provide safety for them.

He physically protect us. He protects us spiritually from attacks of the enemy. Um, not just physical, not just, you know, Jason borne guns and running your whatever, um, bodyguard,

Josh: but like, okay.

Andrew: No, but I mean, when I Rob a bank, I pray, you know, before

Josh: I would,

Andrew: yeah, that’s right. No, but I’m just saying like, You know, there are times when I put God in the bodyguard box, you know, not the box, but I know that he can do that role in a, in a full way, in a way spiritually that I can’t do.

You know, I just gotta recognize that I come up short in a lot of ways. That’s one of them. Um, so yeah, I guess all of these things are just partial views. They’re like one, one hand touching the elephant, you know, um, and this isn’t even like a full and perfect picture, um, of God by any means, but there. All I’m trying to communicate is that these things are bigger than just one trait.

God’s not just judge. God’s not just French, just vending machine, just theoretical, just safety net. Like God’s many, many things, and you can get to know. That over time. Um, and one of the best ways to do it is to read what the heck is in the Bible. I can pray about it and ask God to reveal to you. What’s in there, like even in the analogies, Jesus uses the, the parables, you know, often in the new Testament, especially Matthew, that as soon as Jesus explains a parable to a group of a thousand people or 50 people, you know, his disciples are right there.

Their first question is. What the heck did you mean? He’s like, yeah, let me, let me reveal it to you. You know, so God, God will let us know him. You know, he’s not just a mystery. He doesn’t want to stay a mystery and doesn’t want to stay just a judge or just a state body guard.

Josh: So that’s good. Yeah. That’s good.

Like in like, if there’s one word to describe God that I think is safe to start with. Um, though God is vast and God, it does have money. Attributes and characteristics of God is personal. Like God desires to have relationship and conversation with you. I’m like, that’s why he sent Jesus to restore that.

Like you go all the way back to Genesis and that’s what it was. It was relationship and moving God and Adam, and as they walked side by side through the garden and Adam was naming things. Yeah. God was watching his creation essentially come to being, um, And then we saw sent into the picture and it created this weird separation between God wanted.

And what now was it created this divide and, um, God’s ultimate desire was that we’d be back in relationship and that’s why he sent Jesus to take on the sins of humanity to take your sins on my son’s on, um, and to, to die in the place of, as the punishment for those sins. So we can be restored. So if you’re a follower of Jesus, and this is what we mean by when we say follower, geez, I don’t know where you are in this spiritual journey, but, um, followers uses really just recognizing like, God I’ve sinned against you.

I’ve done the opposite of what you’ve asked me to do and who you’ve asked me to be. Um, and I was wrong like that cause the separation between us and I want you to restore that separation. So I believe that Jesus was the son of God that he did live a perfect life, that he did die and, and. Uh, for my sins and raise from the dead like that is the gospel in itself.

And if you choose to believe that, and that’s the thing that begins, right. A relationship with Jesus. So your life is now his, and you could just start on journey. But so many of us start in this journey and that’s just where we stop. Yeah, like I got my salvation secured and we’re good, but, but we don’t get to the full life that Jesus promised when we stopped there, get to experience this, this richness in relationship and richness and purpose and a richness in life.

When we stop there, I’m like we got, keep it pursuing Jesus and deepening conversation. And I’ll be honest with you at first. Is it awkward? 100%. Is it off? Um, if, if you did have a great. Yo moment with Jesus receive. So with Jesus, and then you start talking to Jesus, will you start talking to him again?

It’s going to be awkward. Absolutely. Just like it’s awkward. And you’re talking to a friend. The beautiful thing is, you know, you think of those friends that. You’re able just to pick up a conversation so quick. Sorry I dropped something. That’s why I walked away. And the funny thing is, it’s just a stupid cap, but I’m fine with it.

So it’s important to me. Um, but, uh, uh, when, when we stop in those places of that’s all, it is like you miss out on this, this. What could be you missed out on this richness. And I think this is the place and why people find why Christians, those that should be, see it be full of hope and full of faith and full of courage.

Um, because like we’re Jesus’s and we’re in relationship with Jesus. So there’s nothing that he can’t speak into or intervene on. Um, that’s why they’re so discouraged. And that’s why they’re so. For lack of better term, sad at times and depressed and dealing with junk is because they’ve stopped in relationship and in growth, like God is a personal spirit.

He tells us that he sent his spirit, his Holy spirit into live into our souls, and we are in direct connection with God almighty. And through that process. Um, but we miss out on so much of that, or we just want God to intervene when it’s convenient for us. But in all reality, like we’ve got to pursue relationship.

Like, yeah, I have friends in my life that, you know, we go months without talking to each other, but when we pick up the phone or we, we, um, You know, get dinner together, lunch together. Like we pick up that conversation really quickly. That’s the similar to the same relationship with Jesus. You’re picking up where you left off and you’re moving on, but going back to even gods this pruning season you’re in and we find ourselves in these previous seasons, well, hopefully you’re finding ourselves in these bruising seasons on it.

These pruning seasons on a regular basis, if you’re not, um, you’re probably not listening. Um, but uh, we find ourselves in these places, like it’s easy to look at this and say, well, here’s all the things that God said I’m wrong in and I need to fix. Yeah. Well, he didn’t say you need to fix them. Right.

That’s not part of that. Some part of the conversation, you won’t find that in scripture, right? What do you, what are you saying is, yeah, this is sin. You need to repent from sin, but I’m going to walk with you in the midst of all of this. That’s why I went to the cross. So it’s not, Hey, you know, God, it’s not God almighty saying, fix this, this and this now figure it out.

No, it’s God am I saying, Hey, this, this and this, or causing destruction, this, this, and this, or are going to destroy this, this, and this are not just destroying you, but the destroying those around you. And we don’t want that. Let me help you fix that. Um, so now you’re digging into relationship, right? Like if there’s a safe terminology to use with God, it’s God is personal.

Yeah. And then if we can chase after those things and believe those things, you’re going to end up in a much better place in a much better view of who God actually is then to hone in on one of these little and going back to this idea, like. A lot of times our views of, I know I’m talking for a long time.

Josh. I can say that. It’s all good. This is great. But I think this is, I think this is worth hitting. Um, like oftentimes our parents are our representation of God. Hmm. So if you have a faulty view of God, oftentimes it’s a fault of your parents and I’m not saying your parents suck blame them. I’m saying they’re sinful human beings.

So don’t take their examples and put them on God, because it’s not going to work. Right. Like, well, my father, my father is an amazing man. I love him deeply, but from. The age of whatever you are in fourth grade, eight, nine years old. Like my father lived over a thousand miles away or somewhere around that.

I don’t know geography. Couldn’t tell you how far it actually is, but yeah, pretty close to there. So God was distant a lot of my life. Yeah. Because my dad was distant a lot in my life. Um, so I had to dig into those things that my, my God isn’t distant. My God is. Actively involved in my life. Not only that he’s actively involved in this relationship, he’s communicating just like I need to be communicating.

Um, but you got to dig into those, those faulty views that we’ve kind of picked up along the way and no fault of your parents. They’re human beings. It’s reality. It’s just what it is. Um, but you’ve got to dig into those things. Like if your dad is a hard ass and he’s kinda, he constantly rode you, like, we’re going to put that on God.

Yes, oftentimes, but that’s not who God is. God is not a heart. Yes. Right. He’s not going to ride you. His ultimate goal is that you experience the full life is the ultimate goal is that you become the full follower of Jesus that he desires. Yeah. He’s not going to get you there by riding your ass, how this works, and he knows that he loves you.

He loves you deeply. And he’s trying to dig into the shitty parts of your life too. Pull out and prune out the bad things to get to the good thing. I wouldn’t say this he’s pruning out the good things to get to the great things. Um, like as you, as you go through this journey. So, so like, oftentimes if there’s traits of your, your father, your traits, your mother, that you try to pick up and put on God, recognize them quickly.

Recognize them for being wrong and, and dig into the things that are true of God. And I just want to read this, actually I’ll have Josh read this list cause he has this list and we’ve been talking for a long time, but like what are some, if we were to define God, like what are the characteristics of the words you would put?

Andrew: Yeah. And, and I, and I know just let me give a little preface here. We. We’re kind of entering the final thoughts part of this discussion, but I, I kinda think this might be part one of a couple discussions and it might not be next week that we do part two, but I kind of, I think we unpacked pretty well.

The partial views of God or the fragile views of God that we were thinking about, but maybe we need to spend some more time on like, More complete views of God, um, uh, in the weeks ahead. So, so we might revisiting this a lot more. We’ll see. We’ll see. But I like the scripture you put above this it’s revelation one eight, I’m the alpha and the Mecca says the Lord who is, and who was, and who is to come the almighty.

So just wrap all of that into this God was, is that alpha and Omega I’m the beginning and the end. Who was and is, and is to come. I am all things that is who God is. He is beginning and the end of your journey, beginning and ending of your story, who was there before you, he’s going to be there after you.

Um, so God is huge. Uh, God is powerful. Um, so it, God is personal. He’s a personal spirit. You can actually know him. And we’ve talked about that a little bit. God is all powerful. Point to revelation one eight, the beginning and the end of the journey and all things throughout, um, God is present everywhere like omnipresent, you know, God is, is everywhere.

God, uh, God,

Josh: no, it was having conversations with you today. Probably at the same time. He’s having conversation with me.

Andrew: That’s right. He’s not bound by the physical. Things that bind us, you know, God literally you blow your mind just

Josh: for a second. Go ahead. Jada is also not bound by time. We live on our timeline.

God doesn’t live on a time. So God is a much present right now, as God is present right now in this moment. Birth, right. Jesus is dead, right? Like you’re right. Sense of that.

Andrew: Yeah, you can’t because we are bound by time.

Josh: Um, you hope, God knows

Andrew: everything. He’s he’s omniscient. He got, got it understands all things.

The thoughts of your mind in this very moment. And the thoughts in my mind is very moment, as well as the things that happen a thousand years ago, and they’re going to happen a thousand years from now. He knows all things. Um, Sovereign God is sovereign. Holy God is Holy set apart. Holy one, unique God is Holy.

That is absolute truth. Not just, not just those small truths we were talking about. Like, I can find a little truth here and a little there. God is the absolute truth.

Josh: Cut is the definition of truth. We find truth only yet. Oh,

Andrew: that’s right. The, you know, darkness never pushes out light. But light can push out darkness.

God is absolute truth. He’s not a partial truth. He is the definition of absolute, absolute truth. God is righteous. God is just, God is love. God is merciful, faithful, and one that you have as the number 13, but I love. God never changes. Um, you said it with the time analogy or not analogy, you said it was God live, God exists out there aside time and chooses to be in time to affect us.

But God never changes. He’s he’s always been. All these things and he will always be all those things. It’s he doesn’t change. You know, he’s not a seasoned, he’s not a,

Josh: I will say the

Andrew: wind in the sea. God never

Josh: will say this cause because we’ve covered it. You know, in terms of moving from old to new Testament, God does change how he interacts with us.

That doesn’t change his character. That doesn’t change who he is, but he does change how we interact with and interacts with us.

Andrew: Doesn’t change new ideas at all. God has been steady and the same. All the way throughout. And I don’t know, I, I do think we should spend some more time on this man, because I’ve enjoyed this a lot.

And I feel like we got partway there and, and, and I’m happy with where we got, but I think there’s more to go and that we could focus on some of those things of what God is. Um, it’d be helpful to me and be good conversation with you. So.

Josh: That’s good, man. I’m hosting a retreat next at the beginning of next month, and there’s definitely things we’ve talked about today that I’m going to steal for that retreat.

Probably you’re fragile. You’re fragile view of God, fragile to, you’ve got an idea. I like that. I think it’s important. I like

Andrew: that. Awesome, man.

Josh: Hey Josh, as always. It’s good to see my friend.

Andrew: Good to see you, man. Thanks for talking. This is great

Josh: for sure. Hey, if you just kind of stumbled upon us, please subscribe to us.

That always helps us out. Um, if someone sends you to us, um, let us know that that person sent you to us. Cause we would like to say a big thank you to that individual. Um, and monetarily. No monetarily gift, gift them with something, just to say, thank you. If you want to share us with your friends and the orphans come, um, we would love to gift you with something as well.

Um, it probably be a sticker, but we’ll go bigger than that. We would just give you a sticker. Cause what that cost us like 25. We’re going to mail it to you for a sacrifice. I’m going to mail it to you. So that’s like 50 cents an hour at 75 cents. Um, but I’m also gonna send you some books and some other resources.

I think that are, are super helpful, um, to this journey of this jesus’ life. Um, but yeah, rate us, subscribe to us. Thank you so much for listening. We love you guys. We are praying for you guys. Uh, we pray for you guys before we started this episode. I’ll be honest with you. We did pray for you to start a last episode because I said I would, might get distracted and it just, and then we started the episode.

Most of the time we do pray for you. That’s right. That’s right, Josh. Good to see my friend. Good to see you. My friend .